Trauma – PTSD

Question:

 how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths)

how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions

related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d

probably never share – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

Hi tmp, I don’t think we’ve met.  Welcome to our little corner of the net.  I hope you find empathy here and to know you are not alone. As for the process with th’py.  Well I think that everyone’s experience is different.  I can only share what happened with mine. I think from almost the beginning my T thought I was DID.  However, she first dxd me with PTSD.. which is very common.   It also has a strong element of dissociation attached with it.  She waited though to tell me about the DDNOS/DID until she thought I was ready to hear it.  Also she needed to gather enough evidence in her presence to also offer that dx.  A T from my experience takes a time, because a wrong dx is much more harmful, then just taking time to make sure they truley understand what is going on in the mind. Progress is slow going and if anything as a patient I have learned the frustration and the value of patience. First of all if you are DID– the T has to make sure that the system feels safe in the th’py enviroment. The T also must gain trust.  And with most people I have met on here, (me included) that is the hardest part.  That comes in stages.  It is not a fast or easy process. You asked when will the T ask about DID questions. Hmmm, mine never really did in an overt manner.  For me that would of shut down my system down quickly. Over a couple of months though through our talks and stuff she would throw in a subtle question here or there. It wasn’t until about my third month in th’py she even brought up the topic of DID.  My response…."I am not Sybil." And I am not Sybil, I have since learned everyone’s system is different.  Just as every singleton is different. So I think every T has to approach th’py with regards to that fact.  No shoe fits all. You asked when progress will be made– well in my mind progress has already been made– you have started going to th’py and want to deal with your issues.  That is a HUGE first step and shouldn’t be overlooked. Journaling is an excellent way to share with a T.  I don’t give my journal to the T, but I share things or copy things out of it for her to read.  Sometimes it is easier then me just trying to talk about it. Safari

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

thanks safari for your input…… it calms me a lil bit.  ill try 2 b patient. tx again. tmp

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi tmp, I don’t think we’ve met.  Welcome to our little corner of the net.  I hope you find empathy here and to know you are not alone. As for the process with th’py.  Well I think that everyone’s experience is different.  I can only share what happened with mine. I think from almost the beginning my T thought I was DID.  However, she first dxd me with PTSD.. which is very common.   It also has a strong element of dissociation attached with it.  She waited though to tell me about the DDNOS/DID until she thought I was ready to hear it.  Also she needed to gather enough evidence in her presence to also offer that dx.  A T from my experience takes a time, because a wrong dx is much more harmful, then just taking time to make sure they truley understand what is going on in the mind. Progress is slow going and if anything as a patient I have learned the frustration and the value of patience. First of all if you are DID– the T has to make sure that the system feels safe in the th’py enviroment. The T also must gain trust.  And with most people I have met on here, (me included) that is the hardest part.  That comes in stages.  It is not a fast or easy process. You asked when will the T ask about DID questions. Hmmm, mine never really did in an overt manner.  For me that would of shut down my system down quickly. Over a couple of months though through our talks and stuff she would throw in a subtle question here or there. It wasn’t until about my third month in th’py she even brought up the topic of DID.  My response…."I am not Sybil." And I am not Sybil, I have since learned everyone’s system is different.  Just as every singleton is different. So I think every T has to approach th’py with regards to that fact.  No shoe fits all. You asked when progress will be made– well in my mind progress has already been made– you have started going to th’py and want to deal with your issues.  That is a HUGE first step and shouldn’t be overlooked. Journaling is an excellent way to share with a T.  I don’t give my journal to the T, but I share things or copy things out of it for her to read.  Sometimes it is easier then me just trying to talk about it. Safari how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID? how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

tmp, I understand the impatience…believe me– I am still impatient.  It is not one of my virtures.  It gets frustrating and it is okay to feel frustrated.  I think though if you read her long enough you will see we all get frustrated at different times in our therapy.  Why isn’t it going any faster, will I ever get anywhere.  It is a process with many advances, many stand stills and steps back.  One of the most important things is to be gentle with yourself. Safari

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – thanks safari for your input…… it calms me a lil bit.  ill try 2 b patient. tx again. tmp Hi tmp, I don’t think we’ve met.  Welcome to our little corner of the net.  I hope you find empathy here and to know you are not alone. As for the process with th’py.  Well I think that everyone’s experience is different.  I can only share what happened with mine. I think from almost the beginning my T thought I was DID.  However, she first dxd me with PTSD.. which is very common.   It also has a strong element of dissociation attached with it.  She waited though to tell me about the DDNOS/DID until she thought I was ready to hear it.  Also she needed to gather enough evidence in her presence to also offer that dx.  A T from my experience takes a time, because a wrong dx is much more harmful, then just taking time to make sure they truley understand what is going on in the mind. Progress is slow going and if anything as a patient I have learned the frustration and the value of patience. First of all if you are DID– the T has to make sure that the system feels safe in the th’py enviroment. The T also must gain trust.  And with most people I have met on here, (me included) that is the hardest part.  That comes in stages.  It is not a fast or easy process. You asked when will the T ask about DID questions. Hmmm, mine never really did in an overt manner.  For me that would of shut down my system down quickly. Over a couple of months though through our talks and stuff she would throw in a subtle question here or there. It wasn’t until about my third month in th’py she even brought up the topic of DID.  My response…."I am not Sybil." And I am not Sybil, I have since learned everyone’s system is different.  Just as every singleton is different. So I think every T has to approach th’py with regards to that fact.  No shoe fits all. You asked when progress will be made– well in my mind progress has already been made– you have started going to th’py and want to deal with your issues.  That is a HUGE first step and shouldn’t be overlooked. Journaling is an excellent way to share with a T.  I don’t give my journal to the T, but I share things or copy things out of it for her to read.  Sometimes it is easier then me just trying to talk about it. Safari how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID? how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

sounds like you’re doing exactly what you’re supposed to be doing.  the process takes awhile. is kid tawk now, k?  tek deep breff, let out slow, tell self "i’m doing good job.  i’m doing ok.  it’s ok."  don’t hafta be worried bout whether have DID or not.  sounds like worry over whether DID could be red herring to cover up something else feels yukky and not wann deal with.  we do that a lot here.  could be wrong, though… but if have DID, then have DID.  if not, then not.  either way, have yukk feelings wann get rid of, wann life be better, be happy, yes?  so no matter what dx.  and even if not have DID by doc’s or T’s rules, doesn’t mean ya can’t have kids inside, or different parts that feel like different ppl. you might want to look into some of the theories of personality.  they talk about the different aspects of the self/personality.  one of them talks about having an inner child, or two or three.  talks about having different parts that feel different.  and is *normal* psychology.  i mean, not "abnormal psychology".  right?  theories say this is how normal people are, having inner childs and different parts with different characteristics that can feel like different people. and everyone has some kind of problem with the interaction of their different aspects of the self – it’s the human condition.  and thpy can be helpful to some ppl in working thru the parts of those interactions inside that are causing problems living a happy life. so…you doing good work.  is good.  keep doing good work. maybe will help.  but maybe don’t worry bout dx.  cuz is mebbe red herring. red snapper velly tasty.  red herring not so good. *nods* the dyennaths hath sthpoken! *hee* (kids here are having some problems today, but also having fun, cuz bigs are leaving alone to work thru probs.  so being silly and whacked out.  *hee*  oops, time to go back to babbling on the "mamamamamamama" theme again!  i’ve developed a theory today that if the ppl in institutions who sit and babble to themselves, drool dripping down their faces, etc, were able to type and were sat (were sitteth?) (*hee*) on the right hand of…wait…no no no no no…sorry.  um, got lost in mental rut.  um. oh, so if they were put in front of puter or typewriter, with put hands on keys, could maybe communicate somewhat coherently, even though they look like they’re totally out of it.  cuz that’s what i’m doing right now.  :) *hee*) *dyennatths!*  (means is dyenths!) dyenths for dyenths. is ok if not all made sense.  doh, bigs’re trying to make us make sense again…..*pout*  *hee*  :) [ed. note:  my profoundest apologies for the incoherence. please take anything useful from this that you may, and leave the rest.]  <ahh, the bigs are staying out of the kids way because the body starts twitching badly if the bigs come out.  mebbe is time for dyenths to call T again.  sorry talkin weird bout me in reply to you.  sorry sorry.

is what puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she

mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first

meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good

info….. that felt like – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – just asks a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) message how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

thanks, ok, and yes, i think i have amnesia related to DID…… wow i block stuff out like crazy to survive.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

np, thanks for input. i’ll try to keep going and talking and see where it leads.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – sounds like you’re doing exactly what you’re supposed to be doing.  the process takes awhile. is kid tawk now, k?  tek deep breff, let out slow, tell self "i’m doing good job.  i’m doing ok.  it’s ok."  don’t hafta be worried bout whether have DID or not.  sounds like worry over whether DID could be red herring to cover up something else feels yukky and not wann deal with.  we do that a lot here.  could be wrong, though… but if have DID, then have DID.  if not, then not.  either way, have yukk feelings wann get rid of, wann life be better, be happy, yes?  so no matter what dx.  and even if not have DID by doc’s or T’s rules, doesn’t mean ya can’t have kids inside, or different parts that feel like different ppl. you might want to look into some of the theories of personality.  they talk about the different aspects of the self/personality.  one of them talks about having an inner child, or two or three.  talks about having different parts that feel different.  and is *normal* psychology.  i mean, not "abnormal psychology".  right?  theories say this is how normal people are, having inner childs and different parts with different characteristics that can feel like different people. and everyone has some kind of problem with the interaction of their different aspects of the self – it’s the human condition.  and thpy can be helpful to some ppl in working thru the parts of those interactions inside that are causing problems living a happy life. so…you doing good work.  is good.  keep doing good work. maybe will help.  but maybe don’t worry bout dx.  cuz is mebbe red herring. red snapper velly tasty.  red herring not so good. *nods* the dyennaths hath sthpoken! *hee* (kids here are having some problems today, but also having fun, cuz bigs are leaving alone to work thru probs.  so being silly and whacked out.  *hee*  oops, time to go back to babbling on the "mamamamamamama" theme again!  i’ve developed a theory today that if the ppl in institutions who sit and babble to themselves, drool dripping down their faces, etc, were able to type and were sat (were sitteth?) (*hee*) on the right hand of…wait…no no no no no…sorry.  um, got lost in mental rut.  um. oh, so if they were put in front of puter or typewriter, with put hands on keys, could maybe communicate somewhat coherently, even though they look like they’re totally out of it.  cuz that’s what i’m doing right now.  :) *hee*) *dyennatths!*  (means is dyenths!) dyenths for dyenths. is ok if not all made sense.  doh, bigs’re trying to make us make sense again…..*pout*  *hee*  :) [ed. note:  my profoundest apologies for the incoherence. please take anything useful from this that you may, and leave the rest.]  <ahh, the bigs are staying out of the kids way because the body starts twitching badly if the bigs come out.  mebbe is time for dyenths to call T again.  sorry talkin weird bout me in reply to you.  sorry sorry. is what puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like just asks a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) message how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

ok thanks safari, tries to b gentle with self…… i can do that a lil better when ppl dont yell at me….. wife causes me stress. whew…. but i cant blame ppl all the time, sometimes i just have hard time coping with life……. and i "lose it".

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – tmp, I understand the impatience…believe me– I am still impatient.  It is not one of my virtures.  It gets frustrating and it is okay to feel frustrated.  I think though if you read her long enough you will see we all get frustrated at different times in our therapy.  Why isn’t it going any faster, will I ever get anywhere.  It is a process with many advances, many stand stills and steps back.  One of the most important things is to be gentle with yourself. Safari thanks safari for your input…… it calms me a lil bit.  ill try 2 b patient. tx again. tmp Hi tmp, I don’t think we’ve met.  Welcome to our little corner of the net.  I hope you find empathy here and to know you are not alone. As for the process with th’py.  Well I think that everyone’s experience is different.  I can only share what happened with mine. I think from almost the beginning my T thought I was DID.  However, she first dxd me with PTSD.. which is very common.   It also has a strong element of dissociation attached with it.  She waited though to tell me about the DDNOS/DID until she thought I was ready to hear it.  Also she needed to gather enough evidence in her presence to also offer that dx.  A T from my experience takes a time, because a wrong dx is much more harmful, then just taking time to make sure they truley understand what is going on in the mind. Progress is slow going and if anything as a patient I have learned the frustration and the value of patience. First of all if you are DID– the T has to make sure that the system feels safe in the th’py enviroment. The T also must gain trust.  And with most people I have met on here, (me included) that is the hardest part.  That comes in stages.  It is not a fast or easy process. You asked when will the T ask about DID questions. Hmmm, mine never really did in an overt manner.  For me that would of shut down my system down quickly. Over a couple of months though through our talks and stuff she would throw in a subtle question here or there. It wasn’t until about my third month in th’py she even brought up the topic of DID.  My response…."I am not Sybil." And I am not Sybil, I have since learned everyone’s system is different.  Just as every singleton is different. So I think every T has to approach th’py with regards to that fact.  No shoe fits all. You asked when progress will be made– well in my mind progress has already been made– you have started going to th’py and want to deal with your issues.  That is a HUGE first step and shouldn’t be overlooked. Journaling is an excellent way to share with a T.  I don’t give my journal to the T, but I share things or copy things out of it for her to read.  Sometimes it is easier then me just trying to talk about it. Safari how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID? how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

Safari and tmp, if you mean the Dissociative Experiences Scale, it doesn’t diagnose DID/DDNOS. it’s a screening test, not a diagnostic test. i.e., it should be used to determine whether a clinician should use other instruments or methods (like interviews, which is probably what she’s using now) to diagnose a dissociative disorder (DD). it’s a misuse of the test to use it to determine if you have DID. for one thing, your score can’t tell you whether you have DID or DDNOS. no matter how high someone scores, s/he still probably does *not* have DID or DDNOS e.g., say someone scored 80, which is a very high score on the DES. (IIRC most ppl score in the 10s.) still, most of the ppl scoring 80 would *not* have DID or DDNOS. and, as Safari says, some ppl with DID or DDNOS would have low scores. so no score, no matter how high or how low, can tell you that you have or don’t have a DD. only a clinical interview or similar methods can determine that. using the test to diagnose (either rule in or rule out) DID or DDNOS is a misuse of the test IMO but i think some (many?) Ts use it that way. (i have no idea why since i’ve read several very clear explanations of why that’s inappropriate. i think one of them is on the web site with the test.) one of my Ts even used it to try to find out what kind of dissociative disorder i had, i.e., whether i had DID (which is what he thought) or just DDNOS, which is a bizarre use of the test IMO, even if he was an MD.  oddly (well, maybe not , he was working with someone with a PhD in psychology, which is sad IMO bc a psych PhD should definitely know better than that. the bottom line is that if your T is already clinically evaluating whether or not you have a dissociative disorder, the DES isn’t going to add anything and may even muddy the waters. it might be fun to take for your own amusement (as long as you realize that it won’t tell you if you have a dissociative disorder or not, much less what kind), but i don’t think it makes any sense for your T to give it to you since she’s already clinically assessing whether you have a DD. fwiw, there are a couple of interview scales (e.g., the SCID-D) that a clinician can use to help diagnose DID but i think they take longer than a few minutes. HTH, e – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp

Response:

e, I think you put it much more eloquently then me… but basically that was my line of thinking… ) Safari

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Safari and tmp, if you mean the Dissociative Experiences Scale, it doesn’t diagnose DID/DDNOS. it’s a screening test, not a diagnostic test. i.e., it should be used to determine whether a clinician should use other instruments or methods (like interviews, which is probably what she’s using now) to diagnose a dissociative disorder (DD). it’s a misuse of the test to use it to determine if you have DID. for one thing, your score can’t tell you whether you have DID or DDNOS. no matter how high someone scores, s/he still probably does *not* have DID or DDNOS e.g., say someone scored 80, which is a very high score on the DES. (IIRC most ppl score in the 10s.) still, most of the ppl scoring 80 would *not* have DID or DDNOS. and, as Safari says, some ppl with DID or DDNOS would have low scores. so no score, no matter how high or how low, can tell you that you have or don’t have a DD. only a clinical interview or similar methods can determine that. using the test to diagnose (either rule in or rule out) DID or DDNOS is a misuse of the test IMO but i think some (many?) Ts use it that way. (i have no idea why since i’ve read several very clear explanations of why that’s inappropriate. i think one of them is on the web site with the test.) one of my Ts even used it to try to find out what kind of dissociative disorder i had, i.e., whether i had DID (which is what he thought) or just DDNOS, which is a bizarre use of the test IMO, even if he was an MD.  oddly (well, maybe not , he was working with someone with a PhD in psychology, which is sad IMO bc a psych PhD should definitely know better than that. the bottom line is that if your T is already clinically evaluating whether or not you have a dissociative disorder, the DES isn’t going to add anything and may even muddy the waters. it might be fun to take for your own amusement (as long as you realize that it won’t tell you if you have a dissociative disorder or not, much less what kind), but i don’t think it makes any sense for your T to give it to you since she’s already clinically assessing whether you have a DD. fwiw, there are a couple of interview scales (e.g., the SCID-D) that a clinician can use to help diagnose DID but i think they take longer than a few minutes. HTH, e tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp

Response:

ps – it can be hard to be patient. but it sounds like your T is trying to take her time to figure things out. i think that’s good. sorry that it’s so hard to wait. e – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ok thanks safari, tries to b gentle with self…… i can do that a lil better when ppl dont yell at me….. wife causes me stress. whew…. but i cant blame ppl all the time, sometimes i just have hard time coping with life……. and i "lose it".

Response:

Hi tmp, dissociation (amnesia) is not necessarily mean you are DID.  That is the tricky part of all of this– I can be just plain "dissy" and it not be DID at all. In fact most of my lost time is due to the fact I am just disconnected from myself and my surroundings. I call it living in my head.  I can go through things on automatic pilot and my mind just be somewhere else. It is like there is a barrier between me (the bubble) and the world.  Take for example e, (waves hi to e– she is a singleton) but she also has a problem with dissociation.  DID has more then just being dissociative qualities.  It also has to do with the view of the self and many other factors.  That is why some of us have said try to be patient.  It isn’t something that a T is going to figure out in just a few visits. (IMO at least a good T– there may be some who would jump to those conclusions etc, but remember a proper dx is much better then a wrong dx — which can be much more harmful to you.)  I know some of us here have been labeled as schizophrenic or psychotic by T’s or Shrinks because they jump to conclusions about their dx.  My first shrink after only 2 visits had decided a year of my T’s work was off course and that I was psychotic and schizo and tried to put me on medications to quiet "my voices".  She was fired after that incident..especially since I was only seeing her to help with my depression/anxiety.  She decided to go off on her own tangent and only having seen me for a total of 1 hour.  As hard as it is, try to be patient. Safari Safari

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – thanks, ok, and yes, i think i have amnesia related to DID…… wow i block stuff out like crazy to survive. tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

I empathize tmp, it is such a frustrating process…. I hope you don’t feel like I have been pre*ching to you.  That isn’t my intent.  You seem to have a lot of questions.  All we can do here is share our experiences– and it is different for everyone. There are so many variables, that have to be ruled out and it takes time.  The best thing I can advise is to learn as much as you can about dissociation, PTSD and such.  Especially if you are seeing a Pdoc or on any kind of medication. You are your own best advocate by being informed. As for stress and losing it.  It is quite difficult to handle so many things at once.  Especially when you first start th’py and are going through the process. I found myself a lot of the first year of th’py being overwhelmed.  So whatever you can do to relieve some of the other stressors in your life is always helpful. You said your wife causes you a lot of stress?  Is she aware of what is going on?  Have you sat down and talked with her? If I am being too nosey, I am sorry. Safari

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ok thanks safari, tries to b gentle with self…… i can do that a lil better when ppl dont yell at me….. wife causes me stress. whew…. but i cant blame ppl all the time, sometimes i just have hard time coping with life……. and i "lose it". tmp, I understand the impatience…believe me– I am still impatient.  It is not one of my virtures.  It gets frustrating and it is okay to feel frustrated.  I think though if you read her long enough you will see we all get frustrated at different times in our therapy.  Why isn’t it going any faster, will I ever get anywhere.  It is a process with many advances, many stand stills and steps back.  One of the most important things is to be gentle with yourself. Safari thanks safari for your input…… it calms me a lil bit.  ill try 2 b patient. tx again. tmp Hi tmp, I don’t think we’ve met.  Welcome to our little corner of the net.  I hope you find empathy here and to know you are not alone. As for the process with th’py.  Well I think that everyone’s experience is different.  I can only share what happened with mine. I think from almost the beginning my T thought I was DID.  However, she first dxd me with PTSD.. which is very common.   It also has a strong element of dissociation attached with it.  She waited though to tell me about the DDNOS/DID until she thought I was ready to hear it.  Also she needed to gather enough evidence in her presence to also offer that dx.  A T from my experience takes a time, because a wrong dx is much more harmful, then just taking time to make sure they truley understand what is going on in the mind. Progress is slow going and if anything as a patient I have learned the frustration and the value of patience. First of all if you are DID– the T has to make sure that the system feels safe in the th’py enviroment. The T also must gain trust.  And with most people I have met on here, (me included) that is the hardest part.  That comes in stages.  It is not a fast or easy process. You asked when will the T ask about DID questions. Hmmm, mine never really did in an overt manner.  For me that would of shut down my system down quickly. Over a couple of months though through our talks and stuff she would throw in a subtle question here or there. It wasn’t until about my third month in th’py she even brought up the topic of DID.  My response…."I am not Sybil." And I am not Sybil, I have since learned everyone’s system is different.  Just as every singleton is different. So I think every T has to approach th’py with regards to that fact.  No shoe fits all. You asked when progress will be made– well in my mind progress has already been made– you have started going to th’py and want to deal with your issues.  That is a HUGE first step and shouldn’t be overlooked. Journaling is an excellent way to share with a T.  I don’t give my journal to the T, but I share things or copy things out of it for her to read.  Sometimes it is easier then me just trying to talk about it. Safari how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID? how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

Hi tmp, dissociation (amnesia) is not necessarily mean you are DID.  That is the tricky part of all of this– I can be just plain "dissy" and it not be DID at all. In fact most of my lost time is due to the fact I am just disconnected from myself and my surroundings.

that’s definitely how it is for me. i’m apparently very dissy but not at all multiple. I call it living in my head.  

well, at least you know where you are.  mine seems more like absence seizures bc, often, i’m not aware of anything in my head, either. that may be a difference between multiples and singletons or maybe not. i haven’t talked to all that many dissy singletons but many of the ones i’ve talked to didn’t go into their heads, at least not that they remembered. but quite a few did so that’s not a definitive difference. (plus, some ppl with DID aren’t at all aware of alters so they might also feel like they aren’t going into their head or aren’t switiching when they switch. like me, they may only be aware of having been out of it for some periof of time. if they’re aware of that. sometimes i’m not.) i guess that’s another thing that makes diagnosing complicated. I can go through things on automatic pilot and my mind just be somewhere else.

yep. It is like there is a barrier between me (the bubble) and the world.  Take for example e, (waves hi to e– she is a singleton) but she also has a problem with dissociation.  DID has more then just being dissociative qualities.  It also has to do with the view of the self and many other factors.  That is why some of us have said try to be patient.  

yep. although it’s hard. i think you’ve done a very good job of explaining the need for patience, Safari. It isn’t something that a T is going to figure out in just a few visits. (IMO at least a good T– there may be some who would jump to those conclusions etc, but remember a proper dx is much better then a wrong dx — which can be much more harmful to you.)  

yep, yep, yep. e.g., my T thought i was multiple and had DID. not good. although back then (and maybe now), the orthodoxy was to treat any dissociative disorder, esp DDNOS,  pretty much in the same way you’d treat DID. (i think that makes sense if you’re a multiple with DDNOS but not if you’re a singleton with DDNOS. which even my T admitted after a couple of years but he couldn’t find *any* information on treating dissy singletons other than the DID-type stuff. neither could the Ts i knew personally not i.) i’ve never known ANY dissy singleton who was helped by that DID-like treatment. most of the ones i’ve talked to were harmed by it, even though that’s what the DD experts said to do. (i dunno if they still recommend that or not. i hope not.) so, please, be careful and patient to make sure about what’s going on. I know some of us here have been labeled as schizophrenic or psychotic by T’s or Shrinks because they jump to conclusions about their dx.  

yep.  :-( My first shrink after only 2 visits had decided a year of my T’s work was off course and that I was psychotic and schizo and tried to put me on medications to quiet "my voices".  

    ~  doesn’t sound at all helpful to me. She was fired after that incident..especially since I was only seeing her to help with my depression/anxiety.  

good for yous.  :-) She decided to go off on her own tangent and only having seen me for a total of 1 hour.  As hard as it is, try to be patient. Safari

yep. i think it *is* hard. and i think clients have to learn a lot about meds and therapy and things like and then, if they know how, listen to themselves bc sometimes even the experts are very wrong and recommend things that are very harmful. but i think ppl often know if they’re on the right track. if it feels right and you’re making progress, you’re on the right track. even if the progress isn’t as quick as you’d like it. and even if you are on the right track, it can take a while, esp in the beginning when you and your T are getting to know each other. e – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – thanks, ok, and yes, i think i have amnesia related to DID…… wow i block stuff out like crazy to survive.

Response:

ok, trying 2 b patient, which sometimes isnt so bad bec i forget everything….

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi tmp, dissociation (amnesia) is not necessarily mean you are DID.  That is the tricky part of all of this– I can be just plain "dissy" and it not be DID at all. In fact most of my lost time is due to the fact I am just disconnected from myself and my surroundings. I call it living in my head.  I can go through things on automatic pilot and my mind just be somewhere else. It is like there is a barrier between me (the bubble) and the world.  Take for example e, (waves hi to e– she is a singleton) but she also has a problem with dissociation.  DID has more then just being dissociative qualities.  It also has to do with the view of the self and many other factors.  That is why some of us have said try to be patient.  It isn’t something that a T is going to figure out in just a few visits. (IMO at least a good T– there may be some who would jump to those conclusions etc, but remember a proper dx is much better then a wrong dx — which can be much more harmful to you.)  I know some of us here have been labeled as schizophrenic or psychotic by T’s or Shrinks because they jump to conclusions about their dx.  My first shrink after only 2 visits had decided a year of my T’s work was off course and that I was psychotic and schizo and tried to put me on medications to quiet "my voices".  She was fired after that incident..especially since I was only seeing her to help with my depression/anxiety.  She decided to go off on her own tangent and only having seen me for a total of 1 hour.  As hard as it is, try to be patient. Safari Safari thanks, ok, and yes, i think i have amnesia related to DID…… wow i block stuff out like crazy to survive. tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp long time, in my exp. sharing journal sounds good. did you mention your interest in ruling out DID? jt (dyenths) how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID?  how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

Response:

FWIW, we scored very low on a short test (not even sure what test it was) that we took *after* T dx’ed DID and I was sure the dx was wrong. When we scored so low, T said, haha,  "Okay, who did the testing? You all scored unusually low for being D.I.D." hahaha! (guess you had to be there. come to think of it, i’m not sure i even thought that was funny at the time.) I spent much time trying to convince T I was *not* D.I.D. Thought the dx would k*ll my marriage for sure (hubby had already consulted an attorney for d*v*rce, i was out of my mind with fear). It’s been a year and a half since dx and I’d love to take that test again and see what happens. Oh, and, btw, our marriage is better than ever. )   And for whoever said it, yes, the *longest* and most difficult obsticle to thp’y was finally being able to trust T (and selves?) enough to even start talking (about past). That was the hardest part. missing this ng, Dayzie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – e, I think you put it much more eloquently then me… but basically that was my line of thinking… ) Safari Safari and tmp, if you mean the Dissociative Experiences Scale, it doesn’t diagnose DID/DDNOS. it’s a screening test, not a diagnostic test. i.e., it should be used to determine whether a clinician should use other instruments or methods (like interviews, which is probably what she’s using now) to diagnose a dissociative disorder (DD). it’s a misuse of the test to use it to determine if you have DID. for one thing, your score can’t tell you whether you have DID or DDNOS. no matter how high someone scores, s/he still probably does *not* have DID or DDNOS e.g., say someone scored 80, which is a very high score on the DES. (IIRC most ppl score in the 10s.) still, most of the ppl scoring 80 would *not* have DID or DDNOS. and, as Safari says, some ppl with DID or DDNOS would have low scores. so no score, no matter how high or how low, can tell you that you have or don’t have a DD. only a clinical interview or similar methods can determine that. using the test to diagnose (either rule in or rule out) DID or DDNOS is a misuse of the test IMO but i think some (many?) Ts use it that way. (i have no idea why since i’ve read several very clear explanations of why that’s inappropriate. i think one of them is on the web site with the test.) one of my Ts even used it to try to find out what kind of dissociative disorder i had, i.e., whether i had DID (which is what he thought) or just DDNOS, which is a bizarre use of the test IMO, even if he was an MD.  oddly (well, maybe not , he was working with someone with a PhD in psychology, which is sad IMO bc a psych PhD should definitely know better than that. the bottom line is that if your T is already clinically evaluating whether or not you have a dissociative disorder, the DES isn’t going to add anything and may even muddy the waters. it might be fun to take for your own amusement (as long as you realize that it won’t tell you if you have a dissociative disorder or not, much less what kind), but i don’t think it makes any sense for your T to give it to you since she’s already clinically assessing whether you have a DD. fwiw, there are a couple of interview scales (e.g., the SCID-D) that a clinician can use to help diagnose DID but i think they take longer than a few minutes. HTH, e tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp

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No, she doesn’t know all of what is going on….. she knows I think I have anyone knowing….. stuff my friends say I need to be careful about because could get me in trouble.  (online long distance friends).

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I empathize tmp, it is such a frustrating process…. I hope you don’t feel like I have been pre*ching to you.  That isn’t my intent.  You seem to have a lot of questions.  All we can do here is share our experiences– and it is different for everyone. There are so many variables, that have to be ruled out and it takes time.  The best thing I can advise is to learn as much as you can about dissociation, PTSD and such.  Especially if you are seeing a Pdoc or on any kind of medication. You are your own best advocate by being informed. As for stress and losing it.  It is quite difficult to handle so many things at once.  Especially when you first start th’py and are going through the process. I found myself a lot of the first year of th’py being overwhelmed.  So whatever you can do to relieve some of the other stressors in your life is always helpful. You said your wife causes you a lot of stress?  Is she aware of what is going on?  Have you sat down and talked with her? If I am being too nosey, I am sorry. Safari ok thanks safari, tries to b gentle with self…… i can do that a lil better when ppl dont yell at me….. wife causes me stress. whew…. but i cant blame ppl all the time, sometimes i just have hard time coping with life……. and i "lose it". tmp, I understand the impatience…believe me– I am still impatient.  It is not one of my virtures.  It gets frustrating and it is okay to feel frustrated.  I think though if you read her long enough you will see we all get frustrated at different times in our therapy.  Why isn’t it going any faster, will I ever get anywhere.  It is a process with many advances, many stand stills and steps back.  One of the most important things is to be gentle with yourself. Safari thanks safari for your input…… it calms me a lil bit.  ill try 2 b patient. tx again. tmp Hi tmp, I don’t think we’ve met.  Welcome to our little corner of the net.  I hope you find empathy here and to know you are not alone. As for the process with th’py.  Well I think that everyone’s experience is different.  I can only share what happened with mine. I think from almost the beginning my T thought I was DID.  However, she first dxd me with PTSD.. which is very common.   It also has a strong element of dissociation attached with it.  She waited though to tell me about the DDNOS/DID until she thought I was ready to hear it.  Also she needed to gather enough evidence in her presence to also offer that dx.  A T from my experience takes a time, because a wrong dx is much more harmful, then just taking time to make sure they truley understand what is going on in the mind. Progress is slow going and if anything as a patient I have learned the frustration and the value of patience. First of all if you are DID– the T has to make sure that the system feels safe in the th’py enviroment. The T also must gain trust.  And with most people I have met on here, (me included) that is the hardest part.  That comes in stages.  It is not a fast or easy process. You asked when will the T ask about DID questions. Hmmm, mine never really did in an overt manner.  For me that would of shut down my system down quickly. Over a couple of months though through our talks and stuff she would throw in a subtle question here or there. It wasn’t until about my third month in th’py she even brought up the topic of DID.  My response…."I am not Sybil." And I am not Sybil, I have since learned everyone’s system is different.  Just as every singleton is different. So I think every T has to approach th’py with regards to that fact.  No shoe fits all. You asked when progress will be made– well in my mind progress has already been made– you have started going to th’py and want to deal with your issues.  That is a HUGE first step and shouldn’t be overlooked. Journaling is an excellent way to share with a T.  I don’t give my journal to the T, but I share things or copy things out of it for her to read.  Sometimes it is easier then me just trying to talk about it. Safari how long does it take for a new T to ask me questions related to DID? how long does it take for us to make progress?  This history taking isn’t 2 fun and the process feeeeeeels so slow. I shared that with her. On the positive side, she thanked me for giving her so much information. She said she needs all the info. I’m telling her, to help her figure out the best way to "attack" the problem.  There is also tons she doesn’t know yet. I’m thinking of giving her my journal.  That would pretty much complete the information gathering process.  She’d learn stuff I’d probably never share in therapy because I’m too scared and hate thinking about certain things. But they are all pieces to the puzzle.  That would also be the first time I ever shared that with someone I was going to have to sit down and talk with, face to face.  whew. thanks, listening. tmp

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questions… wow, stuff I never thought about like how does my mother express love, joy, sadness, anger….. eepssssssss….. gee, I go to see my T and I get so nervous…. sharing isn’t easy. I don’t know if she is assessing me….. she probably is all the time….. on whether I have DID or what….. she likes me to talk….. she says she learns a lot…. I’m also saying she needs all the info I can give her…… so she can help me put the pieces together….. but I’m nervous about doing that….

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Safari and tmp, if you mean the Dissociative Experiences Scale, it doesn’t diagnose DID/DDNOS. it’s a screening test, not a diagnostic test. i.e., it should be used to determine whether a clinician should use other instruments or methods (like interviews, which is probably what she’s using now) to diagnose a dissociative disorder (DD). it’s a misuse of the test to use it to determine if you have DID. for one thing, your score can’t tell you whether you have DID or DDNOS. no matter how high someone scores, s/he still probably does *not* have DID or DDNOS e.g., say someone scored 80, which is a very high score on the DES. (IIRC most ppl score in the 10s.) still, most of the ppl scoring 80 would *not* have DID or DDNOS. and, as Safari says, some ppl with DID or DDNOS would have low scores. so no score, no matter how high or how low, can tell you that you have or don’t have a DD. only a clinical interview or similar methods can determine that. using the test to diagnose (either rule in or rule out) DID or DDNOS is a misuse of the test IMO but i think some (many?) Ts use it that way. (i have no idea why since i’ve read several very clear explanations of why that’s inappropriate. i think one of them is on the web site with the test.) one of my Ts even used it to try to find out what kind of dissociative disorder i had, i.e., whether i had DID (which is what he thought) or just DDNOS, which is a bizarre use of the test IMO, even if he was an MD.  oddly (well, maybe not , he was working with someone with a PhD in psychology, which is sad IMO bc a psych PhD should definitely know better than that. the bottom line is that if your T is already clinically evaluating whether or not you have a dissociative disorder, the DES isn’t going to add anything and may even muddy the waters. it might be fun to take for your own amusement (as long as you realize that it won’t tell you if you have a dissociative disorder or not, much less what kind), but i don’t think it makes any sense for your T to give it to you since she’s already clinically assessing whether you have a DD. fwiw, there are a couple of interview scales (e.g., the SCID-D) that a clinician can use to help diagnose DID but i think they take longer than a few minutes. HTH, e tmp Yes there is a "test" and I have seen it on the web. However, imho tests are standardized and does not not fit everyone.  If I had taken the test– I would not of been considered DDNOS/DID.  Because my system is much more subtle then the test.  Because of the co-consciousness of my system I don’t lose great deal of time.  (which is something that is big on that test..) Only under extreme duress does my DID really show. If things are rather calm in my life — my system has the appearance of 1.  What gave me away to my therapist to even begin to think I was DID besides my dissociation blanks in my memory was in one of my first sessions, I referred to myself as we.  At that time I was going through a lot of stuff.  And my system only refers to I as we when under a lot of stress.  In fact I have only one friend who has ever heard me address myself as we.  We both worked in a very stressful job.  No one else I knew had ever heard me refer to myself in that way.  It is an a long tale, but my system figured out a long time ago that in order to function in a singleton world– they must present the front of a singleton. If you want to take the test, mention it to her again. However, I wouldn’t necessarily say it would rule out anything. Just my nickel’s worth… Safari puzzles me….. 3 meetings and not 1 word about it….. she mentioned there is an easy 5min test to give me……. at the first meeting……. but hasn’t my comfort is she said i am giving her lots of good info….. that felt like a simple question…… and then i go off…… and blink, session over. thanks for ur response. tmp

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questions… wow, stuff I never thought about like how does my mother express love, joy, sadness, anger….. eepssssssss…..

Yes, that information is especially tough to talk about– especially when I am like, ummm I don’t know…however, most likely what your T is looking for is what was the home environment like.  Like my childhood environment was one way, where someone else on here could say- they came from an emotional rollercoaster type of family.  Because how your home environment was, often translates in how you deal with life now. gee, I go to see my T and I get so nervous…. sharing isn’t easy.

)  Well when you stop getting anxious when going to your T time to find a new T.  Although I don’t like the anxiety feeling, on a practical note I realize my T is making some headway or I wouldn’t be feeling anxious.  Your right though sharing isn’t easy. My T who is on maternity leave would always ask, when do you remember first feeling like this.  Mr Skeptic would like to say to her sometimes , "hey lady I don’t remember my childhood, why do you even bother asking that stupid question."  However, over time and discussion with her, that was a shut down question for me.  The system would close off every time she said it..so she had to learn to work around it. I don’t know if she is assessing me….. she probably is all the time….. on whether I have DID or what….. she likes me to talk….. she says she learns a lot…. I’m also saying she needs all the info I can give her…… so she can help me put the pieces together….. but I’m nervous about doing that….

Well that is the paradox Tom…or at least it is for me…I (we) want to get better, but yet we still have resistence in wanting to put pieces together. So there are ebbs and flows.  My T I was talking about earlier was also like your T, I would talk about everything and she would make a comment here or there.  Sometimes when nothing was going on I felt like I was just blabbing away.  And when I hit those pockets it was like, okay I am frustrated here– can you give me some direction. My interim T is a bit more interactive, which I like.  I know for sure my hour always passes so quickly now.  Before my other T went on maternity leave, an hour seemed like an eternity.  Tom the pieces will fall into place when you are ready.  That is what has been said to me time and time again.  Things will come when you are ready to hear them and process them.  So try and relax a little and let things develop over time. I am still working on my puzzle and pieces are still being filled in. Safari – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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No, she doesn’t know all of what is going on….. she knows I think I have anyone knowing….. stuff my friends say I need to be careful about because could get me in trouble.  (online long distance friends).

Hi Tom, Well at least she has some knowledge of what is going on.  She knows your in therapy.  It is especially hard on the SO because they know we are hurting but don’t know how to help.  One of the most important things in learning to deal with a relationship is that you do need to be able to share some of what you are going through with her.  And be able to tell her what you need. My SO and I have a code word– if I become quiet and am processing some stuff and don’t feel like talking about it at that time…I say "purple elephant"= which tells him, it isn’t about him and I am not ready to talk about it. It has really helped when I have needed time to think and be quiet and he not worry that he has done something or has anything to do with him. Safari

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" dissociation (amnesia) is not necessarily mean you are DID.  That is the tricky part of all of this– I can be just plain "dissy" and it not be DID at all. In fact most of my lost time is due to the fact I am just disconnected from myself and my surroundings. that’s definitely how it is for me. i’m apparently very dissy but not at all multiple.

aww come on e, just admit it your multiple…. <big laugh I call it living in my head. well, at least you know where you are.  mine seems more like absence seizures bc, often, i’m not aware of anything in my head, either.

I have those too, but not nearly as much as just me pulling inside myself. But I do understand what you mean.  I am sorry but I can’t resist the joke…well are you sure there is anything in your head?  <giggle that may be a difference between multiples and singletons or maybe not. i haven’t talked to all that many dissy singletons but many of the ones i’ve talked to didn’t go into their heads, at least not that they remembered. but quite a few did so that’s not a definitive difference. (plus, some ppl with DID aren’t at all aware of alters so they might also feel like they aren’t going into their head or aren’t switiching when they switch. like me, they may only be aware of having been out of it for some periof of time. if they’re aware of that. sometimes i’m not.) i guess that’s another thing that makes diagnosing complicated.

Definite agreement there about the complications of dxing any type of dissociative disorder.  There are so many variables.  And so many way people disconnect from themselves.  For me, I have noticed 4 ways in which I disconnect. 1. I have the living in my head thing…whichis basically I am on auto pilot but my thoughts are consumed by something else.  So I lose time and lack awareness of things going on around me.  That for me is just plain dissociation.  There is no switching or anything. 2.  There is the bubble effect, as if I am viewing the world through some kind of filter.  At these times I even feel disconnected from myself. Yet, it is not that I have pulled in deeper into myself/ves– it is just like I am in some weird space warp continium.  Time is going by, yet I don’t know where it is going.  Once again that is just dissociation. 3.  Then there are my alters, when they are about (especially the core) I have a co-consciousness with them.  So I am aware of things etc, but later when recalling events etc== they are a bit hazy as if I wasn’t all there– (and I wasn’t) 4.  Then I have the right under my nose switch, I did this more when I was a lot younger– and there are still a couple that are not in the core that I don’t have much contact with– so when they switch out (even briefly) that time is lost. Which when I look at things, I lose more time due to 1 and 2 then I do because of switching. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I can go through things on automatic pilot and my mind just be somewhere else. yep. It is like there is a barrier between me (the bubble) and the world.  Take for example e, (waves hi to e– she is a singleton) but she also has a problem with dissociation.  DID has more then just being dissociative qualities.  It also has to do with the view of the self and many other factors.  That is why some of us have said try to be patient. yep. although it’s hard. i think you’ve done a very good job of explaining the need for patience, Safari. It isn’t something that a T is going to figure out in just a few visits. (IMO at least a good T– there may be some who would jump to those conclusions etc, but remember a proper dx is much better then a wrong dx — which can be much more harmful to you.) yep, yep, yep. e.g., my T thought i was multiple and had DID. not good. although back then (and maybe now), the orthodoxy was to treat any dissociative disorder, esp DDNOS,  pretty much in the same way you’d treat DID. (i think that makes sense if you’re a multiple with DDNOS but not if you’re a singleton with DDNOS. which even my T admitted after a couple of years but he couldn’t find *any* information on treating dissy singletons other than the DID-type stuff. neither could the Ts i knew personally not i.) i’ve never known ANY dissy singleton who was helped by that DID-like treatment. most of the ones i’ve talked to were harmed by it, even though that’s what the DD experts said to do. (i dunno if they still recommend that or not. i hope not.) so, please, be careful and patient to make sure about what’s going on.

Yeah I think the thinking on DDNOS is the same procedures..the mind is fractured as in DID but the parts do not come out.  I read that the line of thought is to still treat in a similar manner.  To me however, any text book guide to treating ANYTHING is wrong.  You should follow this formula, and you will be all better.  That is in my opinion where the MH field gets it wrong.  I think th’py should be as individualized as the patient….I remember some of your stories of th’py and how you were labeled a difficult patient?  Why?  Because you did not fit the little model on how to be treated.  I guess if one thing I could tell the MH field it would be, yes guidelines are good– but to expect it to work for all in the same way, is like trying to put the square peg in a round hole. yep. i think it *is* hard. and i think clients have to learn a lot about meds and therapy and things like and then, if they know how, listen to themselves bc sometimes even the experts are very wrong and recommend things that are very harmful. but i think ppl often know if they’re on the right track. if it feels right and you’re making progress, you’re on the right track. even if the progress isn’t as quick as you’d like it. and even if you are on the right track, it can take a while, esp in the beginning when you and your T are getting to know each other. e

Very much agreed!  My suggestion to anyone entering th’py or going on meds should listen to themselves.  I know it is easy to either be tempted or intimidated by someone who has a degree and think they know what the problem is.  Sometimes they are way off course, and I think an individual knows.  Yet, they don’t want to trust themselves because they feel the MH professional is in a better place to know.  As long as your educated about the process of both th’py and meds, I think learning to trust you own ability to know if you are making progress and if this is the right thing for you.  IMHO Safari

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I guess I should spoiler for images that might disturb – they aren’t literal, but people might not like them anyhow, things I think about as ways of relieving the pain of "living in my head" 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 About living in the head: sometimes it feels as if so much psychological pain dwells in my head that I want to take it off and set it somewhere. Also, I think that’s why the one with the gun pointed at my head shoots and shoots and shoots and shoots, trying to obliterate the source of pain. Sometimes, it is the heart that hurts – occasionally, I have even felt physical pain in the heart area when I have felt hurt by someone. Sometimes, I guess, it’s just we eyes that cry. Beauty. — To email me, remove "nospam" from my address. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – " dissociation (amnesia) is not necessarily mean you are DID.  That is the tricky part of all of this– I can be just plain "dissy" and it not be DID at all. In fact most of my lost time is due to the fact I am just disconnected from myself and my surroundings. that’s definitely how it is for me. i’m apparently very dissy but not at all multiple. aww come on e, just admit it your multiple…. <big laugh I call it living in my head. well, at least you know where you are.  mine seems more like absence seizures bc, often, i’m not aware of anything in my head, either. I have those too, but not nearly as much as just me pulling inside myself. But I do understand what you mean.  I am sorry but I can’t resist the joke…well are you sure there is anything in your head?  <giggle that may be a difference between multiples and singletons or maybe not. i haven’t talked to all that many dissy singletons but many of the ones i’ve talked to didn’t go into their heads, at least not that they remembered. but quite a few did so that’s not a definitive difference. (plus, some ppl with DID aren’t at all aware of alters so they might also feel like they aren’t going into their head or aren’t switiching when they switch. like me, they may only be aware of having been out of it for some periof of time. if they’re aware of that. sometimes i’m not.) i guess that’s another thing that makes diagnosing complicated. Definite agreement there about the complications of dxing any type of dissociative disorder.  There are so many variables.  And so many way people disconnect from themselves.  For me, I have noticed 4 ways in which I disconnect. 1. I have the living in my head thing…whichis basically I am on auto pilot but my thoughts are consumed by something else.  So I lose time and lack awareness of things going on around me.  That for me is just plain dissociation.  There is no switching or anything. 2.  There is the bubble effect, as if I am viewing the world through some kind of filter.  At these times I even feel disconnected from myself. Yet, it is not that I have pulled in deeper into myself/ves– it is just like I am in some weird space warp continium.  Time is going by, yet I don’t know where it is going.  Once again that is just dissociation. 3.  Then there are my alters, when they are about (especially the core) I have a co-consciousness with them.  So I am aware of things etc, but later when recalling events etc== they are a bit hazy as if I wasn’t all there– (and I wasn’t) 4.  Then I have the right under my nose switch, I did this more when I was a lot younger– and there are still a couple that are not in the core that I don’t have much contact with– so when they switch out (even briefly) that time is lost. Which when I look at things, I lose more time due to 1 and 2 then I do because of switching. I can go through things on automatic pilot and my mind just be somewhere else. yep. It is like there is a barrier between me (the bubble) and the world.  Take for example e, (waves hi to e– she is a singleton) but she also has a problem with dissociation.  DID has more then just being dissociative qualities.  It also has to do with the view of the self and many other factors.  That is why some of us have said try to be patient. yep. although it’s hard. i think you’ve done a very good job of explaining the need for patience, Safari. It isn’t something that a T is going to figure out in just a few visits. (IMO at least a good T– there may be some who would jump to those conclusions etc, but remember a proper dx is much better then a wrong dx — which can be much more harmful to you.) yep, yep, yep. e.g., my T thought i was multiple and had DID. not good. although back then (and maybe now), the orthodoxy was to treat any dissociative disorder, esp DDNOS,  pretty much in the same way you’d treat DID. (i think that makes sense if you’re a multiple with DDNOS but not if you’re a singleton with DDNOS. which even my T admitted after a couple of years but he couldn’t find *any* information on treating dissy singletons other than the DID-type stuff. neither could the Ts i knew personally not i.) i’ve never known ANY dissy singleton who was helped by that DID-like treatment. most of the ones i’ve talked to were harmed by it, even though that’s what the DD experts said to do. (i dunno if they still recommend that or not. i hope not.) so, please, be careful and patient to make sure about what’s going on. Yeah I think the thinking on DDNOS is the same procedures..the mind is fractured as in DID but the parts do not come out.  I read that the line of thought is to still treat in a similar manner.  To me however, any text book guide to treating ANYTHING is wrong.  You should follow this formula, and you will be all better.  That is in my opinion where the MH field gets it wrong.  I think th’py should be as individualized as the patient….I remember some of your stories of th’py and how you were labeled a difficult patient?  Why?  Because you did not fit the little model on how to be treated.  I guess if one thing I could tell the MH field it would be, yes guidelines are good– but to expect it to work for all in the same way, is like trying to put the square peg in a round hole. yep. i think it *is* hard. and i think clients have to learn a lot about meds and therapy and things like and then, if they know how, listen to themselves bc sometimes even the experts are very wrong and recommend things that are very harmful. but i think ppl often know if they’re on the right track. if it feels right and you’re making progress, you’re on the right track. even if the progress isn’t as quick as you’d like it. and even if you are on the right track, it can take a while, esp in the beginning when you and your T are getting to know each other. e Very much agreed!  My suggestion to anyone entering th’py or going on meds should listen to themselves.  I know it is easy to either be tempted or intimidated by someone who has a degree and think they know what the problem is.  Sometimes they are way off course, and I think an individual knows.  Yet, they don’t want to trust themselves because they feel the MH professional is in a better place to know.  As long as your educated about the process of both th’py and meds, I think learning to trust you own ability to know if you are making progress and if this is the right thing for you.  IMHO Safari

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