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Hi Marie, >ON toxic parents my Mom and the rest of us are stressing because my >brother is real sick. Storm is brewing. Too bad because we >need our energy for my bro and each other.
Really sorry to hear about your brother, Marie. >I think I will fantasize about all the things I want to say to her and get it out of my system. >Actually saying that stuff to her would be useless.
Sounds incredibly wise. >Luckily us sibs bonded pretty well, all things considered. My brother >got the worst treatment cause he was the parent’s favorite, but we >forgive him now.
You are fortunate that you are able to be there for each other. I am grateful that my sister and I have each other. It was worth all the years of hard work to get there. Take care, Marie. You and your family are in my prayers. Anne – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
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misadventur…@yahoo.com wrote: > As soon >as I saw her handwriting, I was shaking. I couldn’t even open it to read >it. I had my husband do that.
My response was to write "Refused. Return to sender." on the envelope. It only took a couple of returned letters before they stopped completely. I had to develop a strong lack of curiosity about what she had to say. >Not to >mention, it’s a lot easier than trying to explain why you don’t have contact >with a parent.
I just tell people my mother is abusive and I’m safer if she doesn’t know where I am. Nothing I have to explain. I do wonder how she manages to explain to her new husband why she has one child who calls the police when she shows up or tries to make contact. Risa My version of the pledge of allegiance: I pledge allegience to the flag, of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands; one nation, with liberty, justice and religious freedom for all.
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Hey Risa, Long time no see! :-)) "RisaCaitlin" <risacait…@aol.complete> wrote in message
news:20021107002215.03911.00000075@mb-cg.aol.com… > misadventur…@yahoo.com wrote: > > As soon > >as I saw her handwriting, I was shaking. I couldn’t even open it to read > >it. I had my husband do that. > My response was to write "Refused. Return to sender." on the envelope.
That’s what I was thinking too…….the old ‘return to sender’….. It only > took a couple of returned letters before they stopped completely. I had to > develop a strong lack of curiosity about what she had to say. > >Not to > >mention, it’s a lot easier than trying to explain why you don’t have contact > >with a parent. > I just tell people my mother is abusive and I’m safer if she doesn’t know where > I am. Nothing I have to explain. I do wonder how she manages to explain to her > new husband why she has one child who calls the police when she shows up or > tries to make contact.
I love that…….my brother in law called the cops on the witch one time when my sister was there visiting her. My sister or I would have never thought to do that…..but her husband did, surprised the shit out of the old girl. She was so pissed, she locked herself in her bedroom and wouldn’t come out. Well the cops wouldn’t leave until she did……so it was a real stand-off. td – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Risa > My version of the pledge of allegiance: > I pledge allegience to the flag, of the United States of America, and to the > republic for which it stands; one nation, with liberty, justice and religious > freedom for all.
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Hi Kat, Thanks for your reply. It sounds as though many of us share similar experiences with a toxic parent. It took many, many years of hard work before my sister and I could even begin to get along. I agree with you that it’s far more common for siblings from families with one or more toxic parents to find it impossible to form any kind of healthy / loving relationship. If it weren’t for the twelve step programs and being able to make sincere amends to my sister, I know without a doubt there would be no relationship between us now. I remember feeling so guilty for going to kindergarten, worried what our mother would do to my sister. When I left home permanently for NYC at 19, she ran away two weeks later to San Francisco to live on the streets rather than live another minute with the insanity in our home. Thank heavens she survived. I am glad that you are feeling better today. I am happy that Pooh and Tiny’s dog Coda are enjoying a pain free and joyful time running together in the eternities… Take care, Anne – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I’m all right now. Just really hit hard. But Pooh’s all >right now, he doesn’t hurt any more & he’s running with Coda. : ) I miss >him terribly. But time will help with that. >take care, >kat
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Thanks Shannon, kat
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*kat’s strapping on her wading boots for mucking through the shit* : ) You’re right. Went to the post office today, they said to get a box. So that’s what I’m going to do. Thanks Shannon.
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Hi Anne, > I am so sorry that you are going through such a jolting experience now.
I just don’t do well getting blindsided by something. : ( > It doesn’t matter how many shrinks or alternate therapies or spiritual > practices we embrace over the years. We both will shake when we hold a letter > from our toxic, mentally ill, evil, alcoholic, raging, abusive, manipulative > mother.
At least it’s not just me. Because that’s exactly what I do. : ( As soon as I saw her handwriting, I was shaking. I couldn’t even open it to read it. I had my husband do that. > My sister and her husband burn the letters, unopened.
Really, in retrospect, that’s what I should have done. Burned it. Because she never changes. It’s always mindgames. > I read them, waiting for a time when my husband or a close friend are near by > before doing this. I will not read anything from her if I am alone.
I don’t either. My husband reads them, if they’re decent, he’ll read them to me, if it’s not, he just throws away and says to forget it. > The perverse message of expressed love from an evil person is different from > the sincere applogy and transformed heart of a person in recovery…
Yep. You can see it in people’s eyes, if they mean it or not. And toxic people don’t mean it. It’s just another way to get back into your life so they can keep using you as a whipping post on their bad days. It’s all a game, EVERYTHING is a power game with them. > I was the sole executor of my mother’s estate until I realized what that > entailed. Now it’s shared with my sister and her daughter. We are all aware of > the pure evil attached to anything bearing her signature.
Well, at least I won’t have THAT problem. I told her to take me out of her will, because I was sick of her "lording" her money over me as a weapon. I did not, and do not want anything from her. *shudder* So I certainly don’t envy you having to deal with her estate AT ALL. *yuck yuck yuck yuck!!!* The only way I’ve > found to deal with my mother (whom I have not physically seen in ten years) is > to be careful where and when I talk about her. Most people assume she is dead > already because I rarely, ever talk about her.
If anyone asks me, I say she’s dead. And to me, she is, emotionally. That she actually breathes is a minor technicality. Except when she catches me off guard like yesterday. I’ve done that for the last two years. Not to mention, it’s a lot easier than trying to explain why you don’t have contact with a parent. > I have found that incorporating her best work (she is an artist) into some of > my work has taken the "charge" out of one aspect of our relationship. She > tried to destroy me artistically as well as physically, mentally and > emotionally.
I’m really sorry she did that to you. That you’ve been able to overcome that by incorporating her work into yours–that’s really neat Anne. I hope you’re proud of yourself for that. I think that’s awesome. It’s a choice, to stop the abuse, to stop the cycle. And so many of us that have been through it, we’ve made that choice. I’m happy for you that you & your sister can work through it together. So many times abuse ends up destroying all sibling relationships, I’m glad you two decided to NOT let that happen. > Sending you positive vibes and hugs from the prairie lands…
Thanks Anne. I’m all right now. Just really hit hard. But Pooh’s all right now, he doesn’t hurt any more & he’s running with Coda. : ) I miss him terribly. But time will help with that. take care, kat
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hi hopeful, thanks for your post yesterday, i appreciate it. : ) doing much better today. and i couldn’t agree more with you about boundaries. take care, kat – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
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You made perfect sense to me J. David. I’m okay now, much better today. Thanks for caring. kat "J David Phillips" <flmf…@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message news:RaDx9.227651$S8.4215087@twister.tampabay.rr.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi All; > Dealing with the parents is sometimes real hard to do. I had it easy, I > suppose. I took the geographical cure, and moved a thousand miles away. > Now, after over twenty years, we get along pretty well— at a distance. > Even when they stop by infrequently, I can only stand being around them for > about three days. Not too amazing, when I realize that my other two > siblings did the same thing. They are not ‘bad’ people, and I’ve forgiven > them a long time ago for the way they raised me, as I do believe that they > did the best they knew how to do. However, some of the scars I have will > never go away, and I cannot remove them , no matter how hard I’ve tried. > Soooo, I just put them away in a part of my mind, that is behind a locked > door, along with some other ‘issues’ I have— and will deal with them at a > later date. > Some may say that is running away from my problems, but I choose to > believe that I’ve not run away, I’ve just decided not to let these things > run my life. Sometimes, they come out when I least suspect it, and the old > tapes play again. When that happens, sometimes I handle it pretty well, but > sometimes I don’t handle them as well as I could. > The therapist tells me that I have other ‘problems’ to deal with, other > than the obvious one that ’caused’ my PTSD. For now, I’ll take his word for > it, and when I trust him a little more, then maybe we’ll explore a little > more of what makes up J. David’s personality. > I wish Kat well, and certainly hope that she can ‘cope’ another day with > what is bothering her. All of us have had parents, and dealing with people > that have caused us pain in our lives is very , very hard to do. In my > case, I choose to distance myself from the situation, and was able to do it > at the time. I’ve made a somewhat ‘normal’ life for myself down here in the > Sunshine State, and even though I created a whole set of other problems, at > least I can deal with them, without outside influences from them. > Hope this made a little sense, but I doubt it. Thanks for being here. > J. David > flmflam > A-1 Pawn & Jewelry > 1925 S.E.Hwy 19 > Crystal River, Florida, 34429 > fax# 352-795-2093 > px# 352-795-2777 > flmf…@tampabay.rr.com > "Rose Marie Holt" wrote in message > news:rmholt1-4BF99D.15574004112002@news.mindspring.com… > > In article <usdbg111odp…@corp.supernews.com>, > > "kat" > wrote: > > > Hi All, > > > Kat’s in a tailspin because her mother sent her a letter today. Stating > > > that she will always love her, no matter what.
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In article <%lHx9.72109$dn3.2571…@twister.southeast.rr.com>, "tiny dancer" <tinydancer…@nospamhotmail.com> wrote: > But what it did do was let her know…..no longer was I going to listen to > her shit……no longer was I going to just sit there and listen while she > ‘rewrote history’ to make it come out that ’she’ was the ‘one in pain’. It > cleared the air……..for me anyway. > I truly think that’s what did the trick for me kat……….I had enough > wine in me that I just exploded outward at the right person for a > change……towards the end of that phone call I was actually smiling……a > good smile…….and hubby was too. He couldn’t believe all the stuff that > was rolling off my tongue….it just kept coming and coming……..
Great story. I havent been able to do this with my Mom yet – the habit of keeping secrets and keeping feelings hidden as "forbidden" is still there. It’s coming, though
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Hi Marie, She’s always triggered me so bad. Bleahhh……And no, you’re right, she can’t hurt me any more. Only if I allow it. Which is the biggest reason I cut her out of my life, because I don’t need it any more. Just really bad timing. > We protect ourselves the best way we can, dont we?
That’s exactly what my t says. Thanks Marie. take care, kat
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Hi Tiny, >Ellen sounds like she really > know’s how to take care of you……I like her. 
She even knew just when > to call for help and who to call.
Thanks Tiny, I’ll pass that along. She scares the hell out of my husband. I guess she’s kind of a tough one. But my t likes her. > Yeah, everything is fine………just regular appointments, the dentist, or > as I will from this day forward refer to that hygenist ‘the > butcher’……..and then straight to therapy. I had to go to the regular > doctor on Friday…….I just don’t do so well with so many back to > back……..I need a couple weeks in between to regain some > strength……….
I hear you. I’m the SAME way. If I get too many things I have to go out for, I end up feeling so overwhelmed and panicked. I try to force myself to get out at least one time a week, and that’s with hubby. I try hard, but some weeks I can’t even do that. > Just thought maybe giving you something to focus on, the animals, and the > fact that you could help me too………’with some strength’ might help you > to focus better. I know it does me……..if I’ve got something special I"m > supposed to do, or directed to do, I can get a grip better sometimes.
It did tiny, thank you so much. And it made me feel better, knowing that I could do something that would help you. > Especially if I know somebody besides just me ‘needs it’………. I had > a couple panic attacks, and was beginning to freak out a little ’strapped in > that damn dentist chair’………but I kept trying to focus on you riding > your horse or petting the dogs or goats for me. :-)
I have a confession, I usually get 1/2 way corked to go to the dentist’s office. So, I tip my hat to ANYONE that goes sober. : ) lol! Sounds like you did way better than I ever do. I didn’t ride the horse yesterday, but I did put a saddle on a yearling filly. I have 4 new ones, two are weanlings, one is 18months old, and one is 8 years old but hasn’t been ridden since she was 2. I put a saddle on the 18month old one. Went to lead her out to the pasture with it on, she panicked, broke free of me holding her. And proceeded to run, buck, snort, and that stinker bucked off the pad, the stirrups, and the saddle ended up hanging upside down under her belly. Poor thing. I felt sorry for her, but she bolted and I couldn’t hold on to her. So I waited until she had just worn herself out, and then VERY CAREFULLY undid the saddle, and stood far back undoing that last strap. She’s such a high-strung baby. I think breaking her is going to be quite a challenge. She’s what they call "hot". It was beautiful watching her though, because she was trying to break into a running walk, and those front feet were really reaching out there. (she’s a tennessee walker) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > > But you listen to me, I went through this same thing with ‘the wicked > > witch > > > of the midwest’. It’s okay, I know how you feel right now. It will get > > > better, I promise. Try to keep that in mind, tiny says it will get > > > better……….. You’ll eventually get to the place where you will > > > actually ‘really laugh’……..not a big HAHAHA, but a kind of sarcastic > > > laugh……….anyway, you’ll get to the place where you can say ‘fuck > > you, > > > bitch’…….. I know I’m not saying this the best way right now, but > my > > > mind is a mess.
You said it perfectly. I had to laugh (it was a tired one, but it did make me chuckle) when I read TWWMW, because I knew even before you spelled it out what you meant. > YES…….it helped me enormously……..I can’t tell you how much it helped > me. > It was very impowering kat, it really was. I mean I was on a > roll……..
They’re emotional bullies, your mom and my mom sound so much alike. They’ll eat you alive if they’ve had a bad day, just because they know they can do it. Well, now YOUR mom knows you won’t let her do it to you anymore. : ) Way to go!!! Some day, I’ll get there hopefully. Or even better yet, just never have to do anything. Went to the post office today to see about how to get a different address. I’ll be getting a p.o. box come payday. I can’t leave myself vulnerable to her games anymore. It just flips me out. 2 years, it’s been so peaceful. And then, WHAM. I can almost hear her pathetic poor little me voice when you read it. About your mom rewriting history and making herself the "victim", that’s what she’s always done too. It’s disgusting how much and how well the woman lies. > I truly think that’s what did the trick for me kat……….I had enough > wine in me that I just exploded outward at the right person for a > change……towards the end of that phone call I was actually smiling……a > good smile…….and hubby was too. He couldn’t believe all the stuff that > was rolling off my tongue….it just kept coming and coming……..
As gentle and tenderhearted as you are, I bet he was just shocked. If I’d have been there, I think I would have been (toward the end of the phone call, when you were doing better of course) laughing. > Yup…….she knows I won’t take her crap anymore……..she know’s not to > push me over my limit……cause she doesn’t want to ‘listen’ to what I > might say again. Believe me, she’s not changed one little bit,
Not without wanting to change, unless someone wants to, they won’t. That doesn’t surprise me at all about her. But at least she knows now you’re not her doormat anymore, and she’d better watch her p’s and q’s. Because you won’t accept the emotional abuse any more. That is so neat that you were able to do that. What a huge step in the healing process! >I wish I could be there with you kat………giving you > the strength to do it…….like be in the room with you when you call > her……and root you on……
Me too tiny. But with any luck, with her living 600 miles away, and us getting a p.o. box, i won’t have to deal with it any more. > I’m fine kat……….
GOOD! That’s a relief! I’m even better thinking of you petting gizmo and > thinking of me. I came home and curled up on my bed with murphy, snuggling > and petting her belly, which I might add she just loves. As soon as I heard > her begin her really deep breathing/snoring it made me smile. :-) There’s > just something about the way a totally safe secure dog snores, they really > fall into a deep sleep………and listening to it is so relaxing.
I know what you mean. It’s just comforting. > You see if you can come up with an appropriate name for the > bitch……….something that will make even tiny smile, okay?? Where oh > where is Rudy when we need him?? He’d have a great idea, wouldn’t he?? > Have you visited tatoo lately??
No, but me and Sangria had a talk last night. : ) Maybe tonight, that sounds like something enjoyable. > Take it easy tonight kat………just keep close to your babies and let them > comfort you ………..just focus on being the good mama that you are to > them……..and think about me thinking about you, okay? You really helped > me today too kat…..just knowing you’d be with the critters and sending me > strength……..and peace…….
Me helped you? Really? I needed to hear that. Sometimes I just don’t know what to say to folks and then I feel bad because I want to help, but don’t know how. So thank you for saying that. I know I can’t thank you enough for all the help you’ve given me. If you ever come up north, toward Nutville, you know you always have a place to stay. Always. Just let me know ahead of time so I can clean up my house good. *laughing* Wouldn’t want to be embarrassed now…..(and I would be) love, kat
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Hi kat, I wasn’t sure who Ellen was, sorry……I thought maybe it was your therapist or something, but now I understand. Ellen sounds like she really know’s how to take care of you……I like her. She even knew just when to call for help and who to call. > oh i know, i hate going out too. just makes me a nervous wreck. did you > get through them okay? at the risk of sounding nosey though, i sure hope > everything is okay?
Yeah, everything is fine………just regular appointments, the dentist, or as I will from this day forward refer to that hygenist ‘the butcher’……..and then straight to therapy. I had to go to the regular doctor on Friday…….I just don’t do so well with so many back to back……..I need a couple weeks in between to regain some strength………. Just thought maybe giving you something to focus on, the animals, and the fact that you could help me too………’with some strength’ might help you to focus better. I know it does me……..if I’ve got something special I"m supposed to do, or directed to do, I can get a grip better sometimes. Especially if I know somebody besides just me ‘needs it’………. I had a couple panic attacks, and was beginning to freak out a little ’strapped in that damn dentist chair’………but I kept trying to focus on you riding your horse or petting the dogs or goats for me. :-) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > But you listen to me, I went through this same thing with ‘the wicked > witch > > of the midwest’. It’s okay, I know how you feel right now. It will get > > better, I promise. Try to keep that in mind, tiny says it will get > > better……….. You’ll eventually get to the place where you will > > actually ‘really laugh’……..not a big HAHAHA, but a kind of sarcastic > > laugh……….anyway, you’ll get to the place where you can say ‘fuck > you, > > bitch’…….. I know I’m not saying this the best way right now, but my > > mind is a mess. > your mom was a lot like ours, wasn’t she? i saw what ellen wrote. i don’t > remember it, but i see it. : ( kevin says ellen is one of the > "personalities" he’s met, and apparently the t has met her too? all i know > is it just totally blindsided me, getting something from her. i had him > read the letter, i remember crying really hard, going with kev to the feed > mill, and then i lost most of the rest of the day. i think losing time is > one of those blessing-in-disguise type of things sometimes. just can’t deal > with her tiny, not on top of losing pooh. just can’t. like a circuit > overload.
Yeah, the ‘wicked witch of the midwest’ was very similar to yours. Maybe we’ve got to come up with a ‘name’ for yours? I don’t know why exactly, but somehow dubby her ‘TWWTMW’ helped me………..it gave me a ‘visual’ to refer to her by……..maybe stuff like ‘the egg donor’ is a little to personal yet or something……….’the wicked witch of the midwest’ leaves no room for doubt………know what I mean?? And you shouldn’t have to deal with her on top of losing Pooh either. Fuck the bitch………. > > I got a bit tipsy once and gave her hell………real hell……and she no > > longer succeeds at ‘driving that stake into my heart’ ……at least not > > quite as deeply anymore. > did it make you feel better? to release some of it?
YES…….it helped me enormously……..I can’t tell you how much it helped me. It was on a phone call where I began just ‘listening’ once again………and getting more and more depressed….the way she always made me feel. But this time I’d had a couple a glasses of wine before she called……….and after a little while I just let her have it. I told her right out what a pile of bullshit she was trying to put over on me. I told her exactly what I remembered, detail by detail………and everytime she tried to lie about something I stopped her dead in her tracks and told her that was bullshit, I REMEMBER YOU DOING SUCH AND SUCH. I was no longer the meek little ‘listener’……..I was yelling and swearing right back at her. It was very impowering kat, it really was. I mean I was on a roll……..hubby came into the room to see WTF was going on??? I had her on the run big time and it was great. It didn’t ‘change’ anything……..it wasn’t some big reunion or ‘forgiveness’ or anything. It was just turning the tables on her, bringing it all out into the open, where she couldn’t try to undermine me and twist things around to where somehow ’she came out smelling like a flower’ anymore. But what it did do was let her know…..no longer was I going to listen to her shit……no longer was I going to just sit there and listen while she ‘rewrote history’ to make it come out that ’she’ was the ‘one in pain’. It cleared the air……..for me anyway. i tried to do that > once with my mom, but i just crumbled. : ( maybe it was the lack of > alcohol on my part? because it lowers our inhibitions and what-not.
I truly think that’s what did the trick for me kat……….I had enough wine in me that I just exploded outward at the right person for a change……towards the end of that phone call I was actually smiling……a good smile…….and hubby was too. He couldn’t believe all the stuff that was rolling off my tongue….it just kept coming and coming…….. it > sounds like it was kind of a turning point for you to be able to do that > though? that after that, your armor was a little stronger?
Yup…….she knows I won’t take her crap anymore……..she know’s not to push me over my limit……cause she doesn’t want to ‘listen’ to what I might say again. Believe me, she’s not changed one little bit, except for the fact that she know’s I might ‘let her have it’ again…….so she doesn’t say stuff she know’s might/will upset me on the phone……..she backs off…….. I wish I could be there with you kat………giving you the strength to do it…….like be in the room with you when you call her……and root you on…… > >Put the letter away, > hubby did that already i think(?) > >think about Pooh and coda > that makes me smile. those two romping around up there.
I know, it does me too kat. :-) It’s the first time I’ve thought of it that way too, and it helps actually ’seeing’ what they look like, you know, knowing what Pooh looks like so I can visualize them together, playing, chasing…….running like the wind together. We found each other so I’m sure they have too, how could they not! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Do something really special for yourself……….spend the afternoon with > > your animals……….ride a horse……..and please do something for me > > today, cause I really really need it……… > I’m setting here petting and loving on gizmo, we’re both sending you all the > love & strength we can muster. > Please go outside with all > > your critters and give each and every one of them some special loves, > hugs, > > kisses, treats……from tiny. Spend lots of quality time with them each > > and try to send that peace and strength to me so I can calm down too and > go > > to my appointments??? Please, for me??? Remember how much petting a > dog > > calms the inner self?? Please try to do it for both of us and send me > > some, okay?? > i hope you feel better now, (i do) and are calmed down from having to go to > those appointments. > let me know if you’re okay, all right?
I’m fine kat……….I’m even better thinking of you petting gizmo and thinking of me. I came home and curled up on my bed with murphy, snuggling and petting her belly, which I might add she just loves. As soon as I heard her begin her really deep breathing/snoring it made me smile. :-) There’s just something about the way a totally safe secure dog snores, they really fall into a deep sleep………and listening to it is so relaxing. You see if you can come up with an appropriate name for the bitch……….something that will make even tiny smile, okay?? Where oh where is Rudy when we need him?? He’d have a great idea, wouldn’t he?? Have you visited tatoo lately?? Take it easy tonight kat………just keep close to your babies and let them comfort you ………..just focus on being the good mama that you are to them……..and think about me thinking about you, okay? You really helped me today too kat…..just knowing you’d be with the critters and sending me strength……..and peace……. love, tiny – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> love, > kat
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In article <RaDx9.227651$S8.4215…@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, "J David Phillips" <flmf…@tampabay.rr.com> wrote: > Hi All; > Dealing with the parents is sometimes real hard to do. I had it easy, I > suppose. I took the geographical cure, and moved a thousand miles away. > Now, after over twenty years, we get along pretty well— at a distance. > Even when they stop by infrequently, I can only stand being around them for > about three days.
That is what I did – got away. Now I am back, and now I cant leave because of a child custody restriction. I have chosen to allow MOm to have a relationship with the grandkids as long as she behaves – she is far from well, but she has dried out and doesnt try to control me except with the old emotional blackmail stuff – since I hold all the cards – the relationship with the grandkids – she toes the line. She can control herself with the right incentives. she is a lot harder on my sister, who puts up with more of her crap. Mom probably thinks she will have a relationship with me through the kids – NOT. She will probably always think she was a good mother who loved me – that is her problem. She wasnt. I tried to build some kind of relationship with her after some therapy, but it went no where. Maybe it wasnt me!! Distance is wonderful and seems to be what has worked for most people who have posted here. Boundaries, baybee!!! My ex and my Mom can still make me nuts if they catch me off guard. The more distance, the less they catch me off guard. My ex and I always have a Special Master in the room now, and we have rules for when we have to communicate without the S.M. Big relief – distance, boundaries, that he (and I) have to respect. Rules, boundaries, distance – I like it! Every read Games People Play? Lot of difficult people in there. My Mom is in several chapters. My ex is mainly in "Now I Got You, You SOB" Love, Marie > Hope this made a little sense, but I doubt it.
Oh, knock it off!!!! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> J. David
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Hi Marie, > That’s bad. I ran into my Mom today. Thank G*d I seem to be over her. > I think if she gave me a call like that I’d tell her where to go.
i know what you mean…some day, maybe i’ll get to that point too, to be able to do that. i’m glad though that you seem to be over your mom. > Send Kat my best wishes. I hope she can say goodbye to this > relationship.
i cut all contact with my egg-donor about two years ago? she kept calling, so we got our phone number changed. we live 600 miles away, thank goodness. but i think it’s her not being in "control" that’s getting to her. i just want her to leave me alone, that’s it. thanks Marie, i appreciate it. kat
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I couldn’t even begin to recover until I burnt every letter, moved, got an unlisted no. My parents both sent Christmas and Birthday cards with money to me and my kid and I would slice them open, take the money, and put it in a savings account. The cards got tossed without looked at and I would be an emotional wreck for days. They no longer have my address. Comes a point when nothing is going to resolve so you can wallow in the muck or move on and try to forget.
Response:
In article <use0ibhnc45…@corp.supernews.com>, "kat" <misadventur…@yahoo.com> wrote: > your mom was a lot like ours, wasn’t she? i saw what ellen wrote. i don’t > remember it, but i see it. : ( kevin says ellen is one of the > "personalities" he’s met, and apparently the t has met her too? all i know > is it just totally blindsided me, getting something from her. i had him > read the letter, i remember crying really hard, going with kev to the feed > mill, and then i lost most of the rest of the day. i think losing time is > one of those blessing-in-disguise type of things sometimes. just can’t deal > with her tiny, not on top of losing pooh. just can’t. like a circuit > overload.
We protect ourselves the best way we can, dont we? Hang in there – she cant hurt you, not really. You have protection. Love, Marie
Response:
tiny, oh i know, i hate going out too. just makes me a nervous wreck. did you get through them okay? at the risk of sounding nosey though, i sure hope everything is okay? Kat, I’ve got > two appointments this afternoon and I’m just shaking right now……….man > I hate having to go out. > But you listen to me, I went through this same thing with ‘the wicked witch > of the midwest’. It’s okay, I know how you feel right now. It will get > better, I promise. Try to keep that in mind, tiny says it will get > better……….. You’ll eventually get to the place where you will > actually ‘really laugh’……..not a big HAHAHA, but a kind of sarcastic > laugh……….anyway, you’ll get to the place where you can say ‘fuck you, > bitch’…….. I know I’m not saying this the best way right now, but my > mind is a mess.
your mom was a lot like ours, wasn’t she? i saw what ellen wrote. i don’t remember it, but i see it. : ( kevin says ellen is one of the "personalities" he’s met, and apparently the t has met her too? all i know is it just totally blindsided me, getting something from her. i had him read the letter, i remember crying really hard, going with kev to the feed mill, and then i lost most of the rest of the day. i think losing time is one of those blessing-in-disguise type of things sometimes. just can’t deal with her tiny, not on top of losing pooh. just can’t. like a circuit overload. > I got a bit tipsy once and gave her hell………real hell……and she no > longer succeeds at ‘driving that stake into my heart’ ……at least not > quite as deeply anymore.
did it make you feel better? to release some of it? i tried to do that once with my mom, but i just crumbled. : ( maybe it was the lack of alcohol on my part? because it lowers our inhibitions and what-not. it sounds like it was kind of a turning point for you to be able to do that though? that after that, your armor was a little stronger? >Put the letter away,
hubby did that already i think(?) >think about Pooh and coda
that makes me smile. those two romping around up there. > Do something really special for yourself……….spend the afternoon with > your animals……….ride a horse……..and please do something for me > today, cause I really really need it………
I’m setting here petting and loving on gizmo, we’re both sending you all the love & strength we can muster. Please go outside with all > your critters and give each and every one of them some special loves, hugs, > kisses, treats……from tiny. Spend lots of quality time with them each > and try to send that peace and strength to me so I can calm down too and go > to my appointments??? Please, for me??? Remember how much petting a dog > calms the inner self?? Please try to do it for both of us and send me > some, okay??
i hope you feel better now, (i do) and are calmed down from having to go to those appointments. let me know if you’re okay, all right? love, kat
Response:
In article <usdbg111odp…@corp.supernews.com>, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text - "kat" <misadventur…@yahoo.com> wrote: > Hi All, > Kat’s in a tailspin because her mother sent her a letter today. Stating > that she will always love her, no matter what. > The no matter what part is what made me laugh. Kind of like, I forgive you > for being such an ass. Hahahahahahahaha!!!! Rich, huh? > Kat was crying so hard it was just pathetic. She doesn’t need this, she’s > been hanging by a thread over the whole dog business thing. > What a fucking bitch. > Ellen
That’s bad. I ran into my Mom today. Thank G*d I seem to be over her. I think if she gave me a call like that I’d tell her where to go. Send Kat my best wishes. I hope she can say goodbye to this relationship. Best, Marie
Response:
Hi All; Dealing with the parents is sometimes real hard to do. I had it easy, I suppose. I took the geographical cure, and moved a thousand miles away. Now, after over twenty years, we get along pretty well— at a distance. Even when they stop by infrequently, I can only stand being around them for about three days. Not too amazing, when I realize that my other two siblings did the same thing. They are not ‘bad’ people, and I’ve forgiven them a long time ago for the way they raised me, as I do believe that they did the best they knew how to do. However, some of the scars I have will never go away, and I cannot remove them , no matter how hard I’ve tried. Soooo, I just put them away in a part of my mind, that is behind a locked door, along with some other ‘issues’ I have— and will deal with them at a later date. Some may say that is running away from my problems, but I choose to believe that I’ve not run away, I’ve just decided not to let these things run my life. Sometimes, they come out when I least suspect it, and the old tapes play again. When that happens, sometimes I handle it pretty well, but sometimes I don’t handle them as well as I could. The therapist tells me that I have other ‘problems’ to deal with, other than the obvious one that ’caused’ my PTSD. For now, I’ll take his word for it, and when I trust him a little more, then maybe we’ll explore a little more of what makes up J. David’s personality. I wish Kat well, and certainly hope that she can ‘cope’ another day with what is bothering her. All of us have had parents, and dealing with people that have caused us pain in our lives is very , very hard to do. In my case, I choose to distance myself from the situation, and was able to do it at the time. I’ve made a somewhat ‘normal’ life for myself down here in the Sunshine State, and even though I created a whole set of other problems, at least I can deal with them, without outside influences from them. Hope this made a little sense, but I doubt it. Thanks for being here. J. David flmflam A-1 Pawn & Jewelry 1925 S.E.Hwy 19 Crystal River, Florida, 34429 fax# 352-795-2093 px# 352-795-2777 flmf…@tampabay.rr.com "Rose Marie Holt" wrote in message
news:rmholt1-4BF99D.15574004112002@news.mindspring.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> In article <usdbg111odp…@corp.supernews.com>, > "kat" > wrote: > > Hi All, > > Kat’s in a tailspin because her mother sent her a letter today. Stating > > that she will always love her, no matter what.
Response:
Dear Kat and Ellen, I am so sorry that you are going through such a jolting experience now. Perhaps the simple fact of not actually "knowing" the two of you, in a conventional sense, but really knowing where Kat is in an emotional and spiritual sense will enable me to share briefly with you… My sister and I have a good relationship now because of the work I had to do in the eighth and ninth steps of one of my twelve step programs, and the fact that we both wanted to be close after the devistation our mother wrought on both our lives. It doesn’t matter how many shrinks or alternate therapies or spiritual practices we embrace over the years. We both will shake when we hold a letter from our toxic, mentally ill, evil, alcoholic, raging, abusive, manipulative mother. My sister and her husband burn the letters, unopened. I read them, waiting for a time when my husband or a close friend are near by before doing this. I will not read anything from her if I am alone. The perverse message of expressed love from an evil person is different from the sincere applogy and transformed heart of a person in recovery…Even then, I am on guard out of experience dealing with toxic personalities. Tiny’s suggestion to be with your strengths and with powerful, positive memories are wonderful. To take care of yourself in a more nuturing way, which Tiny also suggests, makes tremendous sense. The fact that you do not underestimate the power of contact with toxicity will help you. I was the sole executor of my mother’s estate until I realized what that entailed. Now it’s shared with my sister and her daughter. We are all aware of the pure evil attached to anything bearing her signature. The only way I’ve found to deal with my mother (whom I have not physically seen in ten years) is to be careful where and when I talk about her. Most people assume she is dead already because I rarely, ever talk about her. I have found that incorporating her best work (she is an artist) into some of my work has taken the "charge" out of one aspect of our relationship. She tried to destroy me artistically as well as physically, mentally and emotionally. I accept that there really are evil people on the planet. I also accept that I cannot change them. My decision and my sister’s decision to have no contact with her is the one which works for us, for where we are at this particular point in our lives. Never underestimate the level of cruelty and creative vindictiveness which can come from some evil and toxic people. My sister and I have made a decision to help the next generation be free from this sickness…That it stops with us…that our work to clean up our mess is an ongoing commitment for the rest of our lives. I am grateful that my sister shares my commitment. We both know that very few understand what our mother did (a few mental health people along the way suspected things, but we always moved at least once a year so by the time people caught on, we were out of there and away from any possible intervention while we were growing up). My simple wish and prayer for you, Kat, is that you will be OK, that you will be granted the necessary time to grieve the loss of your beloved dog and that his spirit & memory will be part of the process which both comforts and strengthens you. Sending you positive vibes and hugs from the prairie lands… Anne
Response:
Hi All, Kat’s in a tailspin because her mother sent her a letter today. Stating that she will always love her, no matter what. The no matter what part is what made me laugh. Kind of like, I forgive you for being such an ass. Hahahahahahahaha!!!! Rich, huh? Kat was crying so hard it was just pathetic. She doesn’t need this, she’s been hanging by a thread over the whole dog business thing. What a fucking bitch. Ellen
Response:
"kat" <misadventur…@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:usdbg111odpdbb@corp.supernews.com… > Hi All, > Kat’s in a tailspin because her mother sent her a letter today. Stating > that she will always love her, no matter what. > The no matter what part is what made me laugh. Kind of like, I forgive you > for being such an ass. Hahahahahahahaha!!!! Rich, huh? > Kat was crying so hard it was just pathetic. She doesn’t need this, she’s > been hanging by a thread over the whole dog business thing. > What a fucking bitch. > Ellen
I don’t know who Ellen is, but I’m assuming this is my kat. Kat, I’ve got two appointments this afternoon and I’m just shaking right now……….man I hate having to go out. But you listen to me, I went through this same thing with ‘the wicked witch of the midwest’. It’s okay, I know how you feel right now. It will get better, I promise. Try to keep that in mind, tiny says it will get better……….. You’ll eventually get to the place where you will actually ‘really laugh’……..not a big HAHAHA, but a kind of sarcastic laugh……….anyway, you’ll get to the place where you can say ‘fuck you, bitch’…….. I know I’m not saying this the best way right now, but my mind is a mess. I got a bit tipsy once and gave her hell………real hell……and she no longer succeeds at ‘driving that stake into my heart’ ……at least not quite as deeply anymore. Put the letter away, think about Pooh and coda running through the fields with their little band of followers trailing behind………..ears up, tails up and wagging, noses twitching in the wind to catch the best scent………big brown eyes glowing with happiness, no more bad hips, no more pains of anykind……..like young pups once again. Do something really special for yourself……….spend the afternoon with your animals……….ride a horse……..and please do something for me today, cause I really really need it……… Please go outside with all your critters and give each and every one of them some special loves, hugs, kisses, treats……from tiny. Spend lots of quality time with them each and try to send that peace and strength to me so I can calm down too and go to my appointments??? Please, for me??? Remember how much petting a dog calms the inner self?? Please try to do it for both of us and send me some, okay?? Love, tiny – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
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