Question:
someone please help me…i dont think im gonna get through this…i think i might take all of my meds…im feeling suicidal…i keep scaring people away because i cant calm down…im panicking, im so upset and angry…i can barely breathe, i cant think straight…please God make this pain stop…please God make everything better…i cant take this, im gonna lose the last bit of sanity i have left…please someone help me, please, please, please help me Shana shaynuh…@aol.com Visit the web site created for alt.support.ocd! http://members.aol.com/shaynuh512/page1.html I’m so sick of this roller coaster ride…I want my ticket back!!!
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Whats going on. I know exactly how you feel, trust me! if that helps anyway?
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everything seems worthless, her advice was so harmful, and Im mad at myself, about something, I did while I was getting the advice. I need to go take a 4 hr bath
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What exactly did she say that traumatized you so much? You are a decent guy who just worries too much because of this stupid disease. Most other guys your age don’t even think about half the stuff you do because they are too busy going headfirst, balls to the wall and learning by making many, many mistakes. So your thinking is partially a good thing because you probably do not make as many mistakes as some of your schoolmates, but it’s also bad because it keeps you from enjoying life to the fullest. One good thing, if you ever do find the right woman, you’ll make a decent, sensitive husband. Ida "Woodmere79" <woodmer…@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010506193147.26453.00001585@ng-fv1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> everything seems worthless, her advice was so harmful, and Im mad at myself, > about something, I did while I was getting the advice. I need to go take a 4 hr > bath
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Woodmere79 wrote: > everything seems worthless, her advice was so harmful, and Im mad at myself, > about something, I did while I was getting the advice. I need to go take a 4 hr > bath
Has it ever occurred to you, to answer someone else’s plea, EVER? You are all take and no give. Think about it. Not once, in months of monitoring this newsgroup, have you responded to someone else’s plea for help. NOT ONCE. With all due respect, you are the most self-absorbed person to ever "grace" this newsgroup with your presence. Yet, you post here, hoping for/expecting understanding. This is pure hypocrisy. You, until you show some degree of empathy, are not worthy of anyone’s response. Those who respond are simply fueling your problems. I will not "help you," or anyone else, who is so one-dimensional with their cry for help. Your regular sycophants will insist that I am flaming you; Quite the contrary, I am trying to help. GET REAL, Justin. WAKE UP. The world does not revolve around YOU. Good luck with you problems – try to expand your view of things.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Ida Kern wrote: > What exactly did she say that traumatized you so much? > You are a decent guy who just worries too much because of this stupid > disease. Most other guys your age don’t even think about half the stuff you > do because they are too busy going headfirst, balls to the wall and learning > by making many, many mistakes. > So your thinking is partially a good thing because you probably do not make > as many mistakes as some of your schoolmates, but it’s also bad because it > keeps you from enjoying life to the fullest. > One good thing, if you ever do find the right woman, you’ll make a decent, > sensitive husband. > Ida > "Woodmere79" <woodmer…@aol.com> wrote in message > news:20010506193147.26453.00001585@ng-fv1.aol.com… > > everything seems worthless, her advice was so harmful, and Im mad at > myself, > > about something, I did while I was getting the advice. I need to go take a > 4 hr > > bath
Ida, I guess that is what I was trying to say…
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Woodmere79 skrev i meddelelsen <20010506193147.26453.00001…@ng-fv1.aol.com>… >everything seems worthless, her advice was so harmful, and Im mad at myself, >about something, I did while I was getting the advice. I need to go take a 4 hr >bath
Hang in there, Justin. Whatever it is that is bothering you about this situation is with 99.9 % certainty a result of your OCD. I’m sorry that I can’t really contribute with anything else, but that’s all I can think of saying. Lars
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Charles Webster wrote: > Has it ever occurred to you, to answer someone else’s plea, EVER? > You are all take and no give. Think about it.
Charles, I realise that you are probably feeling frustrated and in pain yourself, but please try to find some other way to let your feelings out than directing them on Woodmere. Woodmere has OCD and when it causes him pain and stress, he vents. That’s perfectly natural. If you have OCD yourself, you know how excruciatingly painful it is to go through a bad obsession. If I had had access to a newsgroup like this when I was 20-24 and going through my first 4-5 major obsessions, I would have flooded it with posts every day hoping that it could make the pain go away. And I sure wouldn’t have written any supportive posts to anybody, because I would be focusing solely on my own pain and fear. That’s perfectly natural as well. >Your regular sycophants will insist that I am flaming you; >Quite the contrary, I am trying to help.
If you really are trying to help, please find another way to do it, because the way you have chosen is more likely to harm than help. So please give it a rest, mkay. Lars
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Dear Justin, I hope you’ll recognize the vile post below as having NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU and everything to do with someone else who must be so desperately miserable in their own life that they feel compelled to criticize and verbally assault other people, especially those like you who are already in a great deal of pain. Justin, you are very welcome in this group — and you always will be. I’m not a spokesperson for any group, but it’s obvious that the other people here care for you and want to help in the ways that we know how. FWIW, it’s becoming clear to me that the author of the post below is simply jealous of the affection that people have for you. The ironic thing is that if he would show some kindness, it would doubtless be returned. Bitter people like that drive their own friends away and have only their own behavior to blame. I’m just very very sad because I know that you will take some of that garbage seriously, that it will unfortunately reinforce some negative feelings about yourself which you already have. So all I can ask is that you sit back, remember all of the people here who are wishing you well, and learn to discard worthless and destructive comments from malicious people. – Jeff Charles Webster <C…@anon.com> wrote in <3AF5E96E.5CD86…@anon.com>: > Woodmere79 wrote: >> everything seems worthless, her advice was so harmful, and Im mad at >> myself, about something, I did while I was getting the advice. I >> need to go take a 4 hr bath > Has it ever occurred to you, to answer someone else’s plea, EVER? > You are all take and no give. Think about it.
[Cruel and vindictive comments deleted] — Jeff Cowen @ ^ ‘98 Rans V-Rex ==–% Waltham, MA () O http://www.BlueSNAFU.com/ — v2.43
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Charles, don’t be a hypocrite as well as an ass. If you have anything even remotely productive to offer, the best place to start would be for you to post a sincere apology for your cruel and repugnant message to Justin. I’ll be impressed if you do, but won’t be holding my breath. – Jeff Charles Webster <C…@anon.com> wrote in <3AF5ED8F.78566…@anon.com>: > Ida Kern wrote: >> What exactly did she say that traumatized you so much? >> You are a decent guy who just worries too much because of this >> stupid disease. >> … > Ida, > I guess that is what I was trying to say…
– Jeff Cowen @ ^ ‘98 Rans V-Rex ==–% Waltham, MA () O http://www.BlueSNAFU.com/ — v2.43
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does saying, I know the feeling help? I know u shouldn’t say I understand but in this case I seriously do. I always worry about what I’ve done and tjhe more u think about it urself the worse it gets? Tell someone about it, it always helpsfor me!! Take a warm bath but don’t wash too much!! =) Hugs and hang in there, Am! =)
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Ditto Justin, I’ve just started following this ng, so I don’t know much about you, but my OCD sometimes makes me obsessive about examining every symptom of my OCD and I get caught up in a big cycle of compulsive worrying. Sometimes even taking a structured "break" helps me. (e.g. "I will do <something else> for a half hour and then I promise I get to return to my obsessing." Often taking a walk out doors and repeating a VERY SIMPLE (just a few words) over and over keeps the obsessive thoughts at bay for a "break". I often use: "I AM LOVED." or "I AM LIFE." It is not possible for anyone to do anything dirty enough to require 4 hours to wash *it* off. ’Sorry, my friend that’s a compulsion. Good luck and hugs if your okay with them. Peas, aka-Steve (replace "com" with "net" to email) On Mon, 7 May 2001 20:44:20 +1000, "Amrit Grewal" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<grewa…@ozemail.com.au> wrote: >does saying, I know the feeling help? I know u shouldn’t say I understand >but in this case I seriously do. I always worry about what I’ve done and >tjhe more u think about it urself the worse it gets? Tell someone about it, >it always helpsfor me!! >Take a warm bath but don’t wash too much!! =) >Hugs and hang in there, >Am! =)
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What’s the difference between beliefs system and thoughts? How can will power change your beliefs?
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A belief system is the model we use to judge our thoughts and actions. A belief system is something we create over time. It is built up from active outside influences (religious education, parents, schooling), passive outside influences (observation) and paradoxically, internal influences from our own thoughts. We constantly take in new information, process it, judge it and reject or accept it based on our existing beliefs. Things we accept tend to be used to build up our beliefs. In a healthy mind our belief system is internally consistent and the results of our actions provide evidence that support our beliefs. In this state we are comfortable and happiness is easier to attain. Our thinking is in harmony with our beliefs. In an unhealthy mind we find that our thoughts and actions conflict with our beliefs. We act in ways that we feel are wrong, and the evidence we get back as a result of our actions also conflict. We see ouselves hurting others or damaging ourselves. And we become unhappy. Establishing harmony between our thoughts and our beliefs is important. I’ll use myself as an example (it’s the only one I have). I suffered chronic low self-esteem for years. My belief system was built up as a result of constant bullying at school, an unemotional family and the fact that I was ‘different’ and felt that I was abnormal. My beliefs were based on my being inferior and my achievments worthless. However, I also had an strong innate sense of right and wrong, of belonging to some greater purpose with an inablity to judge or condemn others. I was also very bright and did well at school (when my self esteem permitted). Life was up an down. My belief system judged everything I did as inadequate, but my thoughts were moral and spiritual. My occasional academic acheivements were also at odds with my beliefs. I grew up confused and unhappy. This continued into adult life. I excelled in my job, another conflict. I was married at 24 and we had our first child a few years later. I had created life! This was a great event but still a conflict with my belief system. More and more evidence was ammasing that my beliefs were wrong. But beliefs are not given up easily, much of our behaviour hangs on them. Changing them can be hard. Especially with the sort of marriage I had. My wife dominated me. She sought to change and ‘improve’ me. She has her own problems, her treatment of me was due to what I believe is a PTSD or maybe a mild OCD. Eventually the stress from all of this built up to the point where I cracked in Sept ‘98. Everything came crashing down. The metaphor of being in a car with no brakes is a good one here, I knew what was happening but had no control. My belief system broke down completely and now I’m in the position of rebuilding it. Hopefully my new beliefs will be better aligned to what I really am. I have an IQ of 158. My Myers-Briggs personality type is INFP (see www.keirsey.com for an explanation of this). These two facts, I think fast and in spiritual terms, explain my sense of being different as a child. I was different! But *not* abnormal. Much of my time now is spent trying to ferret out relics of my old beliefs and replacing them. In a therapy sense the best way to do this is when a belief that causes conflict becomes apparent determine what would be a healthier belief and then think of an action that would cause oneself to act in a way consistent with that belief. This does take will-power. Start small. After acting in this new way for a while observe the results. Did you feel comfortable (eventually)? Did the new way of acting seem to be more true to yourself? If so, keep at it and tell yourself; "This is evidence that my new belief is right". Try and get into a feedback loop; new actions -> new evidence -> new beliefs -> new actions. Bit by bit you can change your beliefs to line up with the way you think and achieve greater harmony. Again, to use myself an example. What have I been doing? Well, posting here for one thig 
Once I would have thought my opinions unworthy and kept them to myself. But I posted a little and got some positive feedback. Now it will be hard to shut me up. I finally got my website started too after weeks of procrastination. It’s still unfinished but can be seen at www.adelaide.net.au/~tlampre. This is another step for me towards the fundamental belief we must all obtain; the belief in ourselves. So, in a nutshell, our thoughts are what we are. Our beliefs are the structure we install to enact and judge our thoughts. It is the bridge between our inner selves and the outside world. But, like any complex system, our thoughts are also determined by the feedback we get through our belief system. This change is called growth. Changing our beliefs is possible, even necessary, and yes, it does require will-power. Regards, Trevor – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Cat Chow wrote: > What’s the difference between beliefs system and thoughts? > How can will power change your beliefs?
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I understand, Shana. Saying "STOP" to yourself is good–I used to do that & actually broke myself of certain OC patterns. When I have the bad thoughts of something happening to someone I love, I say "STOP". If that doesn’t work, I allow the thought to go on, trying to stay detached enuf to figure out where it’s coming from. Sometimes just telling the thought: "Okay, thought, do your worst. I’m ready for you." can diffuse the effect of the thought. Another thing that has helped me is to realize that absolutely none of the horrible accidents I’ve visualized have ever come to pass. I can joke about it & say, "Well, maybe the obsessive thought actually prevented the bad thing!" After all, what are the odds of the bad thing happening in the first place? Take those odds & figure in the odds of the bad thing happening after you’ve thought of that same bad thing, & you’ve lessened the total odds of occurrence! Make sense? As far as getting mad at your BF for him not getting mad…perhaps you feel as if he really took you seriously, he would find your problems to be so overwhelming that they would cause him to be angry at you? So, when he appears to take your problems in stride, perhaps you don’t think he realizes the seriousness of them. I dunno. Sounds like you are lucky to have a BF who can cope w/an OC GF. Maybe HIS way of coping is not to give in to his frustration w/your OCD? Perhaps he does have angry feelings toward you when you are OCing to the max, yet his love for you enables him to focus past the moment & the behavior & hang onto the big picture. Why is sleeping bad? Will you have nightmares? I find sleeping to be one of the most helpful things for me when I get messed up. Vv~ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I am in a very bad place right now and i want to get out….i’m going to try >to >type this as fast as i can because i dont even want to think about these >things…i have been having really really bad thoughts lately, and they seem >to >want to take over…for the past few days i let them, but yesterday i had >enough, and i decided that every time i think something bad, i will think >STOP >or say it out loud, and then try to concentrate on something else…i keep >having bad BAD thoughts about people…well see, i have always had really bad >thoughts that something bad might happen to my boyfriend, and it tears me up >inside…but now these thoughts are about even more severe things, things >that >i can’t even repeat because i fear them so much…i love my boyfriend so much >and he is my best friend…he is behind me 125%, and i love him even more for >that…he doesnt even get mad when i am freaking out…i think sometimes i >get >mad at him for not getting mad…does anyone understand this? i went to my >shrink yesterday and she prescribed me paxil but what do i do in the >meantime? >i am trying to stay busy, but all i feel like doing is sleeping!!! please >help >me!!! i know i don’t want anything bad to happen…but i can’t stop my >thoughts…help!!! >Shana
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On Mon, 22 Feb 1999 12:08:29 +1030, Trevor Lampre – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<tlam…@camtech.net.au> wrote: >A belief system is the model we use to judge our thoughts and actions. A >belief system is something we create over time. It is built up from >active outside influences (religious education, parents, schooling), >passive outside influences (observation) and paradoxically, internal >influences from our own thoughts. >We constantly take in new information, process it, judge it and reject >or accept it based on our existing beliefs. Things we accept tend to be >used to build up our beliefs. In a healthy mind our belief system is >internally consistent and the results of our actions provide evidence >that support our beliefs. In this state we are comfortable and happiness >is easier to attain. Our thinking is in harmony with our beliefs. >In an unhealthy mind we find that our thoughts and actions conflict with >our beliefs. We act in ways that we feel are wrong, and the evidence we >get back as a result of our actions also conflict. We see ouselves >hurting others or damaging ourselves. And we become unhappy.
This post is very good. I even printed it. But there are a few questions, like: I don’t feel happy with the definition of unhealthy mind. Serial killers and other psycopaths have no conflicts between toughts and actions and beliefs. But it’s clear their mind’s unhealthy. They don’t see themselves as hurting themselves or others, on the contrary, they usually believe they’re saving people or society with their killings. >Establishing harmony between our thoughts and our beliefs is important. >I’ll use myself as an example (it’s the only one I have).
Yeah, but beliefs are not always the problem. Sometimes what ought to be changed are thoughts and actions, like in hypocracy cases. (friendly snipp) >My belief system broke down completely and now I’m in the position of >rebuilding it. Hopefully my new beliefs will be better aligned to what I >really am. I have an IQ of 158. My Myers-Briggs personality type is INFP >(see www.keirsey.com for an explanation of this).
Hey, I am an INTJ! And you can tell for this post! >These two facts, I think fast and in spiritual terms, explain my sense of > being different >as a child. I was different! But *not* abnormal.
There are so few INFPs that it almost feel like you’re abnormal. I think scropulosity is a kind of OCD very likely to attack an INFP. >Much of my time now is >spent trying to ferret out relics of my old beliefs and replacing them. >In a therapy sense the best way to do this is when a belief that causes >conflict becomes apparent determine what would be a healthier belief and >then think of an action that would cause oneself to act in a way >consistent with that belief. This does take will-power. Start small. >After acting in this new way for a while observe the results. Did you >feel comfortable (eventually)? Did the new way of acting seem to be more >true to yourself? If so, keep at it and tell yourself; "This is evidence >that my new belief is right". Try and get into a feedback loop; new >actions -> new evidence -> new beliefs -> new actions. Bit by bit you >can change your beliefs to line up with the way you think and achieve >greater harmony.
(another friendly snipp) >So, in a nutshell, our thoughts are what we are. Our beliefs are the >structure we install to enact and judge our thoughts. It is the bridge >between our inner selves and the outside world. But, like any complex >system, our thoughts are also determined by the feedback we get through >our belief system.
I think Freud’s Superego will be a good approximation to what you call belifs system. >This change is called growth. Changing our beliefs is >possible, even necessary, and yes, it does require will-power.
I agree with you here. Maturity, or the action of maturing implyes a challenge of the belief system of the person. We need to weed through what we learnt as right or wrong, and if it doesn’t feel true to us, challenge it and replace it by our new, personal system. This is true for people with a good moral sense. We’ve seen and met quite a few people that thought they were beyond good and evil, and we know they don’t end very well. The moral question creates a lot of anguish in J(judging) types. A P(perceiver) probably never has these problems. But a Thinking Judging type would like to discover the Universal standard that balances acts with thoughts and beliefs. Unfortunately it doesn’t exists, and moral choices are hard an very difficult to live with for Js, especially when the choice challenges the belief system. An example a J guy is against killing people, but he gets drafted and has to fight in a war. An enemy soldier is face to face with him, and the J either kills the enemy or gets killed. So he thinks in his family, how much they need him and kills the enemy. Our J friend had a choice between killing (going against his cherished beliefs) and being killed (a tragedy for himself and his family). Very quickly he had to choose the least of two evils. But for this TJ it’ll be awfully difficult to come to terms with this moment in his life. Sometimes life’s hard… Cat Chow
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> Hi Trevor, > I saved your post. Your descriptions of beliefs, > thoughts and their relationships with our ’selves’ > made a lot of sense to me.
Thanks. It took a while to write it down and I’m never sure if my opinions will be of use to others. Nice to know when they help. But like any model, mine is not perfect. I’ve learnt that the object defines the metaphor, not the other way round. > I think a lot like this > as well and I appreciate the way you wrote it all > down. My mind is a little fuzzy lately due to many > changes in my life, thoughts, beliefs etc… so > it’s nice to have a clear and personal reference > to read over once in a while now – thanks.
Yes, I’ve been through a period of intense change the last few months. It is really hard sometimes to avoid the feeling that I’m throwing out the baby with the bath water. I went a week without sleep in the middle of October, this was when I was ‘accused’ of being MD, as if there is anything morally wrong with being MD. I just had a lot to work through and I have a very driven, focused mind. Still, the Zoloft I was taking elevated me more than was healthy and I’m glad to be off it. > I can relate to a lot of what you wrote – your > personal examples are very familiar to me and I > can appreciate the difficult times you have been > through. (hey! I’m an INFP too!) There is just one
Not many of us about, pleased to meet you. > thing that I would like to add. I found that as I > let go of old beliefs and ideas of who I thought I > was I had to express sadness. Saying ‘bye’ to a > part of myself, eventhough I wanted it gone, was > very sad for me. I had to mourn a lot and go > through periods of sadness.
I can relate to this, warning another long anecdote coming up…(like I have work to do) I let go of a whole swag of old beliefs over Christmas. I was working overseas and had to stay there when the work went over schedule. I was stuck in a hotel during Christmas! I decided I would try and go out and enjoy myself on Christmas eve. This was a huge step for me, I’ve never been a party-goer and here I was in a foreign country looking for company! I figured the best thing was to phone up some match-making places and see if they had anything going. I had trouble finding anything in the telephone book at first but eventually I got lucky. It was listed under ‘marriage agencies’ right next to the ‘massage’ services, hmm… go figure. Anyway, after making sure I was ringing the right sort of place 
I went for it. As providence would have it the first place I rang was having a party in the nightclub of the hotel I was staying in! So bought a ticket. This was enough of a shock on its own but to actually go! Eek! Well, it turned out to be a smashing success. Belief after belief went tumbling into the dust as I found myself dancing and chatting with some really nice girls, chatting with other guys and generally having a great time. The old fears and shyness that left me sitting on the sidelines in the past were still trying to their thing but I just thought "to hell with it" and kept on going. One especially nice thing happened too. Having suddenly discovered how to have fun I had to share my new found knowledge (you know, like a teenager that has just discovered sex and thinks nobody else knows). There was a rather plain, anxious girl sitting near the dance floor. She was gazing longingly at the people dancing but nobody was asking her. So I did. She looked shocked and said no. So I danced with her friend instead. Then I asked her again. She still said no. For nearly 3 hours I kept coming back and still she said no, but she was smiling bigger and bigger each time I came back. I doubt if she had ever had so much attention before. I was in my element, gently joking and teasing her as I kept shooting down all her excuses "It’s too crowded, too empty etc". Finally she ran out of excuses and resorted to her first one again, "Dance with my friend". I said, "If its so scary then your friend can come too". That did it. She finally got up. On the way I maneuvered between the two of them and left her friend behind (she was a willing accomplice). When we got to the dance floor she was shocked to see here friend missing. But she danced, stiffly at first until I mimicked her and made her laugh. We danced about 3 songs before I showed her back to her seat. Later I was going to dance with her again but she wasn’t at her table. She was on the dance floor, by herself, dancing with however came by. She saw me and laughed. The look on her face said, "Yeah, ok. It’s easy". At the end of the evening she came over and thanked me. I only ever knew her first name and I’ll never see her again but it doesn’t matter. The smile on her face will be with me forever. But the number of beliefs about myself that went tumbling that evening we many, and very big ones. Core beliefs about my self esteem, the way I could relate to others, the way I could not just give enjoyment but also accept it. The next day it seemed like a dream and took a while to sink in. I found myself crying at all sorts of odd moments, weeping with happiness, sadness and sheer relief. It went on like this for days. It was embarrassing sometimes, I’d even be crying in the taxi on the way to meet my customer and would have to stare out the window so that none would notice. Many of my poems were sketched out at that time too. Letting go of part of yourself is a grieving process, but like pulling out weeds it lets good things grow if we can plant new seed at the same time. > I am still changing and suspect I always will but > I find it is getting easier as a get older. It’s > not so traumatic as it was in my early 20’s (I’m > 31) and now it can actually be very pleasant to > shed new skin.
Yes, my early twenties were a whirlwind, on and off tranquilizers and antidepressants every few months at times. Change is good, but it’s nice to slacken the pace now and then. > Also, very nice web site Trevor! I like it a lot. > I have bookmarked it and will return! Thanks for > the great post Trevor.
Thank you! I actually wrote a poem about the girl I met while away. I haven’t put it on my web site as I felt it too personal, but maybe I will after all. It’s not something to be ashamed of, I’ll have to find time to add it. Regards, Trevor
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Dang! That was a interesting post Trevor! It was well thought out and conveyed well also. You sound like you may be in the psychological profession? (Just guessing) By all means DO keep posting! It’s good to talk to others! (even if it is electronically) We need more views expressed here,healthy debate,yadda,yadda,yadda. ;0) P.S. By the way if everybody just chips in their two cents worth,i can buy that nice Porsche i’ve had my eye on! -Sparxs-
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Trevor Lampre wrote:
<snipped but saved!> > So, in a nutshell, our thoughts are what we are. Our beliefs are the > structure we install to enact and judge our thoughts. It is the bridge > between our inner selves and the outside world. But, like any complex > system, our thoughts are also determined by the feedback we get through > our belief system. This change is called growth. Changing our beliefs is > possible, even necessary, and yes, it does require will-power.
Hi Trevor, I saved your post. Your descriptions of beliefs, thoughts and their relationships with our ’selves’ made a lot of sense to me. I think a lot like this as well and I appreciate the way you wrote it all down. My mind is a little fuzzy lately due to many changes in my life, thoughts, beliefs etc… so it’s nice to have a clear and personal reference to read over once in a while now – thanks. I can relate to a lot of what you wrote – your personal examples are very familiar to me and I can appreciate the difficult times you have been through. (hey! I’m an INFP too!) There is just one thing that I would like to add. I found that as I let go of old beliefs and ideas of who I thought I was I had to express sadness. Saying ‘bye’ to a part of myself, eventhough I wanted it gone, was very sad for me. I had to mourn a lot and go through periods of sadness. I am still changing and suspect I always will but I find it is getting easier as a get older. It’s not so traumatic as it was in my early 20’s (I’m 31) and now it can actually be very pleasant to shed new skin. Also, very nice web site Trevor! I like it a lot. I have bookmarked it and will return! Thanks for the great post Trevor. — Monkey http://pages.hotbot.com/health/sillychickens/ mon…@gilligansisland.net (to email me axe ‘gilligans’) —
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*HUGS* On 18 Feb 1999 02:39:08 GMT, shaynuh…@aol.com (ShAyNuH512) wrote: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I am in a very bad place right now and i want to get out….i’m going to try to >type this as fast as i can because i dont even want to think about these >things…i have been having really really bad thoughts lately, and they seem to >want to take over…for the past few days i let them, but yesterday i had >enough, and i decided that every time i think something bad, i will think STOP >or say it out loud, and then try to concentrate on something else…i keep >having bad BAD thoughts about people…well see, i have always had really bad >thoughts that something bad might happen to my boyfriend, and it tears me up >inside…but now these thoughts are about even more severe things, things that >i can’t even repeat because i fear them so much…i love my boyfriend so much >and he is my best friend…he is behind me 125%, and i love him even more for >that…he doesnt even get mad when i am freaking out…i think sometimes i get >mad at him for not getting mad…does anyone understand this? i went to my >shrink yesterday and she prescribed me paxil but what do i do in the meantime? >i am trying to stay busy, but all i feel like doing is sleeping!!! please help >me!!! i know i don’t want anything bad to happen…but i can’t stop my >thoughts…help!!! >Shana >"I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
Response:
Hi Shana, Yikes! I know what you are going through. I’ve been there and feel bad that you are going through hell right now. There’s not much I can say that would help you I don’t think. Me saying, ‘try not to think about it’ doesn’t work – I know. All I can say really is that I completely understand how that cyclone of bad thoughts whizzing around in your head can make you feel kind of crazy, frustrated and sad. If sleeping is all you feel like doing and you can take the time to sleep – sleep! OCD freak outs are very exhausting, IMO. Listen to your body maybe sleeping is the best thing for you. If you can, grab a good thought (eg how lucky you are to have a boyfriend that loves you so much!) and concentrate on it, write about it, sing about it, talk about it until you smile. Hang on to that thought and try to grab hold of it each time you start getting negative again. Soon your Paxil will start working and you’ll be able to build up your anti-OCD skills. Until then just try to shift the focus of your racing thoughts to something positive. Keep posting Shana and let us know how you are doing. Hang on – all of the craziness will be over soon. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -ShAyNuH512 wrote: > I am in a very bad place right now and i want to get out….i’m going to try to > type this as fast as i can because i dont even want to think about these > things…i have been having really really bad thoughts lately, and they seem to > want to take over…for the past few days i let them, but yesterday i had > enough, and i decided that every time i think something bad, i will think STOP > or say it out loud, and then try to concentrate on something else…i keep > having bad BAD thoughts about people…well see, i have always had really bad > thoughts that something bad might happen to my boyfriend, and it tears me up > inside…but now these thoughts are about even more severe things, things that > i can’t even repeat because i fear them so much…i love my boyfriend so much > and he is my best friend…he is behind me 125%, and i love him even more for > that…he doesnt even get mad when i am freaking out…i think sometimes i get > mad at him for not getting mad…does anyone understand this? i went to my > shrink yesterday and she prescribed me paxil but what do i do in the meantime? > i am trying to stay busy, but all i feel like doing is sleeping!!! please help > me!!! i know i don’t want anything bad to happen…but i can’t stop my > thoughts…help!!! > Shana > "I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
– Monkey http://pages.hotbot.com/health/sillychickens/ mon…@gilligansisland.net (to email me axe ‘gilligans’) —
Response:
Dear Shana, I’ve learned that I cannot control my thoughts and feelings. I CAN, however, control my behavior. To the extent that I do what works to lessen the OCD behavior, my thoughts and feelings come back to normal. This sometimes takes some time, and I’ve had to learn to sweat out the anxiety. Try this: decide what behavior works (that one is usually easy enough – no checking, no asking for reassurance, etc. etc.) and then commit yourself to DOING THAT. In the meantime, do something else that engages your mind; leave the house if you need to. Ignore your thoughts as best you can; even tell them "Take a hike, you OCD inspired monsters, I’m not buying". Hope this helps, Lisa
Response:
>*HUGS*
Thanks Kbeth, I needed that! Shana "I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hi Shana, >Yikes! I know what you are going through. I’ve been there and feel bad that >you are >going through hell right now. There’s not much I can say that would help you >I >don’t think. Me saying, ‘try not to think about it’ doesn’t work – I know. >All I >can say really is that I completely understand how that cyclone of bad >thoughts >whizzing around in your head can make you feel kind of crazy, frustrated and >sad. >If sleeping is all you feel like doing and you can take the time to sleep – >sleep! >OCD freak outs are very exhausting, IMO. Listen to your body maybe sleeping >is the >best thing for you. >If you can, grab a good thought (eg how lucky you are to have a boyfriend >that >loves you so much!) and concentrate on it, write about it, sing about it, >talk >about it until you smile. Hang on to that thought and try to grab hold of it >each >time you start getting negative again. Soon your Paxil will start working and >you’ll be able to build up your anti-OCD skills. Until then just try to shift >the >focus of your racing thoughts to something positive. >Keep posting Shana and let us know how you are doing. Hang on – all of the >craziness will be over soon. >ShAyNuH512 wrote: >> I am in a very bad place right now and i want to get out….i’m going to >try to >> type this as fast as i can because i dont even want to think about these >> things…i have been having really really bad thoughts lately, and they >seem to >> want to take over…for the past few days i let them, but yesterday i had >> enough, and i decided that every time i think something bad, i will think >STOP >> or say it out loud, and then try to concentrate on something else…i keep >> having bad BAD thoughts about people…well see, i have always had really >bad >> thoughts that something bad might happen to my boyfriend, and it tears me >up >> inside…but now these thoughts are about even more severe things, things >that >> i can’t even repeat because i fear them so much…i love my boyfriend so >much >> and he is my best friend…he is behind me 125%, and i love him even more >for >> that…he doesnt even get mad when i am freaking out…i think sometimes i >get >> mad at him for not getting mad…does anyone understand this? i went to my >> shrink yesterday and she prescribed me paxil but what do i do in the >meantime? >> i am trying to stay busy, but all i feel like doing is sleeping!!! please >help >> me!!! i know i don’t want anything bad to happen…but i can’t stop my >> thoughts…help!!! >> Shana >> "I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!" >– >Monkey >http://pages.hotbot.com/health/sillychickens/ >mon…@gilligansisland.net >(to email me axe ‘gilligans’) >–
Monkey, Thanks for all of the support. Last night I had a real bad time with my anxiety, and something sorta hit me and I decided that I was feeling too much pressure to be this perfect girlfriend. I told my boyfriend that I was feeling all of this pressure to be perfect, and he was really understanding. See, we live together, and we’ve been together for about a year, and I’m only 19, and he’s 21. I was beginning to feel like I am married, and that is way too much stress. He’s my best friend too, and I told him that I really need my best friend right now. I need my boyfriend too, but it is my best friend that can get me through it. He understood what I meant, and we’re still together, but that pressure isn’t there to be this perfect girlfriend to him. He’s so great…I try to focus on that. I think I get angry at him because he is so great. It’s like I’m waiting for him to yell at me and make me stop obsessing, but I am the one that needs to do that…I can’t keep relying on him to cure me. Anyhow, thanks for the response!!! Shana "I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
Response:
I am in a very bad place right now and i want to get out….i’m going to try to type this as fast as i can because i dont even want to think about these things…i have been having really really bad thoughts lately, and they seem to want to take over…for the past few days i let them, but yesterday i had enough, and i decided that every time i think something bad, i will think STOP or say it out loud, and then try to concentrate on something else…i keep having bad BAD thoughts about people…well see, i have always had really bad thoughts that something bad might happen to my boyfriend, and it tears me up inside…but now these thoughts are about even more severe things, things that i can’t even repeat because i fear them so much…i love my boyfriend so much and he is my best friend…he is behind me 125%, and i love him even more for that…he doesnt even get mad when i am freaking out…i think sometimes i get mad at him for not getting mad…does anyone understand this? i went to my shrink yesterday and she prescribed me paxil but what do i do in the meantime? i am trying to stay busy, but all i feel like doing is sleeping!!! please help me!!! i know i don’t want anything bad to happen…but i can’t stop my thoughts…help!!! Shana "I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
Response:
On 18 Feb 1999 23:59:50 GMT, shaynuh…@aol.com (ShAyNuH512) wrote: >I don’t really have a life out side of him, and that is >not healthy.
That’s right. If he’s all your life…what will happen to you if he isn’t there anymore. Panic attack! >So now I have to get up the courage to do things alone. I am just >so happy that my boyfriend is so understanding.
Yes, the best way to deal with these thoughts is to know that no matter what you can get by alone. And then, the other is a very sweet addition to your life. Cat Chow – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Shana >"I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
Response:
On 18 Feb 1999 23:57:01 GMT, shaynuh…@aol.com (ShAyNuH512) wrote: >Thanks for all of the support. Last night I had a real bad time with my >anxiety, and something sorta hit me and I decided that I was feeling too much >pressure to be this perfect girlfriend. I told my boyfriend that I was feeling >all of this pressure to be perfect, and he was really understanding.
This is part of the OCD problem. We want to be perfect and we want everything perfectly running smoothly under control. >See, we live together, and we’ve been together for about a year, and I’m only 19, and >he’s 21. I was beginning to feel like I am married, and that is way too much >stress.
Don’t neglet these feelings. You’re very young. Does it make any difference to you having a marriage certificate? In the other hand, my GM was married at age 19 and very happy about it. >He’s my best friend too, and I told him that I really need my best >friend right now. I need my boyfriend too, but it is my best friend that can >get me through it.
This is the best blessing that can happen to a couple: to be friends first. I think this is why he’s so supportive. >He understood what I meant, and we’re still together, but >that pressure isn’t there to be this perfect girlfriend to him. He’s so >great…I try to focus on that. I think I get angry at him because he is so >great. It’s like I’m waiting for him to yell at me and make me stop obsessing, >but I am the one that needs to do that…I can’t keep relying on him to cure >me. Anyhow, thanks for the response!!!
Very well thought. Nobody but you can, in the end, get you out of this. Cat Chow – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Shana >"I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
Response:
For me the saying STOP thing never worked. It makes the compulsion much worse. I try to analyse the fear and devise three emergency plans in case it happens. Even if the fear is irrational, it calms me down a lot to know that I have three ways to get ahead if the worst happens. I know its hard, but for me forcing myself to stan in front of the problem and face it makes the fear go away, or lose much of its strength. Why don’t you talk to your doc about Xanax? It’ll help you to keep the anxiety down so you can work on those fears instead of freaking out. Cat Chow
Response:
Paul Waterman wrote in message <36CE1784.F90E…@uswest.net>… >OCD is at least partly (maybe mostly even) due to a >nuerochemical process…. >Focus on the positive. Remember that the thoughts ARE ridiculous. Don’t >focus on them. The more you THINK about them, even if you are trying to >unravel them, the more power you give them. You can’t solve this puzzle….
A word of caution here. Make sure the thoughts ARE OCD thoughts and that they do not represent something else going on in your life that needs attention. Some puzzles do need to be solved in order to get relief. > One other idea.. although I never had the guts to try it, is to wallow >in those fears. My Dr (he’s a biological psychologist) recommended it to >me when I went through some similar things. He told me to take my fear >and go home and just WALLOW in it. Think of the VERY WORST case senerio. >He said that if you can do this you can desensitize yourself to it. I >don’t know if it works, but put it on your possibilty list. He gave me a >very good explanation for this approach based on how the brain learns >behaviors but I can’t remember it now
Another word of caution. Wallowing in fears is good therapy for those who are equipped to handle this kind of therapy. Those in a fragile state can can do themselves more harm. I would suggest that a therapist be consulted first. — Take care of your "self". whatatrip rbol…@premier1.net
Response:
>My Dr (he’s a biological psychologist) recommended it to >me when I went through some similar things. He told me to take my fear >and go home and just WALLOW in it. Think of the VERY WORST case senerio.
My doc calls this the "nightmare fantasy", and it’s how I started doing my BT. Take one hour a day, set it aside, and think of the worst case scenario – progress the scene, as it were. I had to write it down or I’d get off track. Very anxiety producing at first – all my scenes had me eventually dying or going crazy, or being a shopping bag lady; always I was alone and had been deserted. The funny thing is, after doing this for several months, the steam did come out of the fears, and they actually became somewhat tedious and boring!
Response:
LisaRachel wrote in message
<19990218080310.28946.00003…@ng-ch1.aol.com>… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Dear Shana, >I’ve learned that I cannot control my thoughts and feelings. I CAN, however, >control my behavior. To the extent that I do what works to lessen the OCD >behavior, my thoughts and feelings come back to normal. This sometimes takes >some time, and I’ve had to learn to sweat out the anxiety. >Try this: decide what behavior works (that one is usually easy enough – no >checking, no asking for reassurance, etc. etc.) and then commit yourself to >DOING THAT. In the meantime, do something else that engages your mind; leave >the house if you need to. Ignore your thoughts as best you can; even tell them >"Take a hike, you OCD inspired monsters, I’m not buying". >Hope this helps, Lisa
I would agree with you to the extent that we cannot control our thoughts and feelings by sheer will (that is why will power has it’s limits), but in controlling our behavior, environment and beliefs systems, we can make changes in those thoughts and feelings, they will change as we change our environment, beliefs and behaviors. Our thoughts and feelings reflect our beliefs, environment and behavior. — Take care of your "self". whatatrip rbol…@premier1.net
Response:
Shana, Hey! I am glad to see you’ve gotten so many positive responses to this already. I think we’ve all been here before. Seems like when it’s bad it’s REALLY BAD doesn’t it? I’m glad to see you’ve talked to someone and they’ve prescribed medication. OCD is at least partly (maybe mostly even) due to a nuerochemical process. Getting treatment -and thank God there is treatment- makes life a whole lot easier. The cloud lifts and suddenly you can see clearly again. So keep working with your doctor. And if what he’s doing isn’t working for you find another one. Get people to help you. Going through it alone is HARD. Tiring too. In the meantime, all the advice you’ve gotten here seems good to me. Focus on the positive. Remember that the thoughts ARE ridiculous. Don’t focus on them. The more you THINK about them, even if you are trying to unravel them, the more power you give them. You can’t solve this puzzle, so put the pieces back in the box and throw the whole damned set away. Not worth your time even bothering with such nonsense. One other idea.. although I never had the guts to try it, is to wallow in those fears. My Dr (he’s a biological psychologist) recommended it to me when I went through some similar things. He told me to take my fear and go home and just WALLOW in it. Think of the VERY WORST case senerio. He said that if you can do this you can desensitize yourself to it. I don’t know if it works, but put it on your possibilty list. He gave me a very good explanation for this approach based on how the brain learns behaviors but I can’t remember it now. Me, I was too lazy (and scared to a degree) to try it. Hard to face your worst fear in that way. Maybe it’s like monsters under the bed though. You get the courage to look under there and all you see is dust bunnies Anyway, keep posting! -Paul
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Dear Shana, >I’ve learned that I cannot control my thoughts and feelings. I CAN, however, >control my behavior. To the extent that I do what works to lessen the OCD >behavior, my thoughts and feelings come back to normal. This sometimes takes >some time, and I’ve had to learn to sweat out the anxiety. >Try this: decide what behavior works (that one is usually easy enough – no >checking, no asking for reassurance, etc. etc.) and then commit yourself to >DOING THAT. In the meantime, do something else that engages your mind; leave >the house if you need to. Ignore your thoughts as best you can; even tell >them >"Take a hike, you OCD inspired monsters, I’m not buying". >Hope this helps, Lisa
Lisa, I just wrote a long response to Monkey’s letter, maybe you should read that…thank you for responding and caring so much…I am trying to stop the bad thoughts…I am with my boyfriend 24/7, and I think that may play a big role in all of this. I don’t really have a life out side of him, and that is not healthy. So now I have to get up the courage to do things alone. I am just so happy that my boyfriend is so understanding. Shana "I’m not crazy…I’m neurochemically challenged!"
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