Question:
Your friend is very lucky to have a friend like you who cares about what is happening to him this way. I know it’s frustrating to watch him do things that aren’t in his own best interest – not working, not taking an active role in finding a solution other than painkillers for his migraines, smoking drinking lots of caffeine-laden things, not keeping regular sleep patterns, not exercising, eating a bad diet. I think you already know how effective it will be (NOT) to just tell him to change those things. It’s commendable that you’re researching this yourself to find out more about it, and to the extent that you have any influence over the way things run in the place you share to live in, all the better. If you personally take care of yourself, exercise, eat right, keep regular hours, live in a healthy way, you can serve as a good example and may make it easier for him too also. Those things wouldn’t hurt you either, even though you’re not suffering from migraines. But I think one thing we (as migraneurs) can tell you is that when you’re in pain, you don’t feel like exercising. You don’t feel like reforming your life and taking on projects. I know I’ve read a million times that caffeine is a drug – I know it’s a vasoconstrictor, and that your body gets used to a certain level of it in your bloodstream and reacts to it being there, and reacts to the absence of it. To get off of caffeine would require me to go through at least a solid week of disabling headaches — I’ve tried and had to stop because I have to work and I wasn’t willing to devote a full week of vacation to detoxing from caffeine. My neurologist agreed that I might even wind up needing hospitalization from the headaches I would get if I go cold turkey off of caffeine. Sometimes people can hear advice a hundred times before they actually HEAR it too. Sometimes they have to be ready to listen to it. So as uncomfortable as it is, you can’t make your friend do anything. The only person’s behavior you can control is your own. You can suggest he try reading this newsgroup. Or you could print out the FAQ and leave it lying in the bathroom or something. And you could tell him (of course, this may be too touchy-feely for a guy) that it really hurts you when you see him having such a hard time and you worry about him, and you think there are some things he could be trying that might help him. And you’d appreciate him respecting your friendship enough to keep an open mind about trying some of those things. Good luck. Rosemary
Response:
You could take the hard ass approach and tell your roomie no the next time he wants you to drive him to the ER. Or at least tell him "this is the last time unless…" Unless he seeks medical help for his headaches. I would not broach the subject about him possibly having an addiction to the ER experience although it sounds to me like this is whats happening. Tell him that there are drugs out there (some of them non-narcotic) that actually will help with headaches. I can attest to this, being a long term sufferer of cluster headaches. Also tell him that you care enough about him to help him through this but that your feeling helpless unless he does something more proactive for his medical problem. I think that he’ll not want to risk the relationship and will agree to take the first step. He needs to know that his use of the ER as a first step for his migraines is abuse. It should be the last step, after nothing else is working. Btw, you didnt mention whether your friend has health insurance. If he doesnt, be prepared for a very expensive journey. Typically, the medications that are used to treat headaches can be costly. Mark I’m at my wits end with my roomate and long time friend. My problem is how do I get my friend to want to get help for his migraines? Some bakckground here, I have known him most of my life, and he has had
snip… Thanks, Eric Zimmerman
** Remove ".nospam" when replying or email will bounce back to you…
Response:
Hi Eric; This chap is fortunate to have a friend like you. Unfortunately, by aiding and abetting him in his drug runs you are probably enabling this behaviour. It may just be time for you to tell him of your concerns and let him know that you’ll drive him to neuro and doctor’s appointments, but not to the emerg, (unless he breaks a leg or something!). He may very well be a drug seeker and his behaviour makes it difficult for other migraineurs to be taken seriously when we present ourselves at emergency rooms. So, support him in positive moves towards resolving the headaches, but refuse to be involved in this self-destructive behaviour. A warning however – don’t expect him to be happy in any way with this approach. Someone who is willing to fight with emerg staff about getting more demerol will likely become very angry when confronted in this manner. You may well find yourself without a roommate. Does he have family or others friends that you might enlist to help you and your friend out? There’s strength in numbers and it’s always helpful to share your concerns with people you trust. All the best; Alex – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m at my wits end with my roomate and long time friend. My problem is how do I get my friend to want to get help for his migraines? Some bakckground here, I have known him most of my life, and he has had migraines for most of it. But the last 6 months have been completely insane! He gets one twice a week, and his life revolves around them. It is becoming a part time job for me just to take him back and forth to the hostpital, i’m not joking. Every time he goes to the hospital, he gets shot up with narcotics like demoral(sp?) or worse, and he constantly battles with the ER doctors to give him more. Often he comes home at night from one hospital and then goes to another one in the morning to get another shot. Some of the local ER’s here won’t give him anything anymore for the pain, because they think he is getting to much drugs, and i’m inclined to agree. I don’t actaully believe he goes just for the drugs, i believe that the headache is real, but how long can you take these drugs before your an addict? He is seeing a nueurologist, but i’m thinking that he goes there so that he can get a treatment plan to take to the ER so they will give him the drugs. At least that is how it is playing out so far. I’m certainly not a doctor, and maybe i shouldn’t be second guessing him, but i’ve not seen anything come of his work. My friend is a freelance artitist, and now does very little work, and is also suffering from depression maybe from the migraines, i don’t know. Now I can understand that he wants relief for the migraines, so he goes to the ER, but he doesn’t do anything to solve the problem long term. I have tried many many times to get him to take a more active role in finding a better solution to his migraines then narcotics, but he is uninterested, and I can’t get him to tell me why. I am really starting to feel guilty taking him to the hospital so he can get narcotics, sometimes the doctor comes in the waiting room, and asks me questions about my friend, questions that are obviously asked to determine if my friend is an addict, and i’m thinking he just might be one. I took a look at the FAQ for this newsgroup, and saw the list of possible triggers, my friend smokes, drinks tons of coffe and sodas, and has no sleep paterns to speek of, no exercise, and a bad diet. Maybe these things contribute to his problem, I don’t know, but I think they contribute to him not wanting to solve his problem. He may think that he would have to change his life style so drasticly to help his migraines that it is just easier to go to the ER. That is my theory anyway. Is there anyway I can get him to *try* to solve this in a better way then he is now? I’m *seriously* worried that in the not to distant future that he will be a homeless drug addict. Thanks, Eric Zimmerman
Response:
This chap is fortunate to have a friend like you. Unfortunately, by aiding and abetting him in his drug runs you are probably enabling this behaviour. It may just be time for you to tell him of your concerns and let him know that you’ll drive him to neuro and doctor’s appointments, but not to the emerg, (unless he breaks a leg or something!).
I’d like to suggest a less-judgmental conversation and, hopefully, solution. Is there any way to go with him to his next neuro appt? The three of you can then put together an agreement for your rommie’s pain management. His neuro may or may not be aware of the ER trips. You have become involved in his pain relief, and you have a right to be part of the decision. Please understand that your friend is most likely in a great deal of pain. He wants to be out of pain, and the only thing he knows gets him there at this point is an ER shot of Demerol. Demerol is available in pill form, and it can be compounded into a suppository form at a compounding pharmacy (those work great for those who have puking migraines.) The neuro could set a limit per month and maybe would be willing to give him something else a little less potent for the rest of the time. Demerol is still the only medication that actually renders me pain-free…and that’s about a one-in-five shots situation. Even if your roomie is not abusing the medication, you may find some help in Al-Anon (there are newsgroups available on-line.) It helps you learn what your boundaries are…should be…ought to be. You decide for yourself what is helping a man in pain vs. facilitating drug abuse. Meds and drugs are the same pills…the difference is why you take them. My husband and i stay active in Al-Anon, as we treat my pain as an addict and not let the pain direct all of my life. I should add that i am also a recovering addict/alcoholic. Treating my pain is a very delicate matter. Please know that my husband would be glad to exchange personal e-mails with you if that would be any help. He has been EXACTLY where you are. This spot is an ugly place to be, but you can get to do-able from here. Deep peace, Lavon
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Your friend is very lucky to have a friend like you who cares about what is happening to him this way. I know it’s frustrating to watch him do things that aren’t in his own best interest – not working, not taking an active role in finding a solution other than painkillers for his migraines, smoking drinking lots of caffeine-laden things, not keeping regular sleep patterns, not exercising, eating a bad diet. I think you already know how effective it will be (NOT) to just tell him to change those things. It’s commendable that you’re researching this yourself to find out more about it, and to the extent that you have any influence over the way things run in the place you share to live in, all the better. If you personally take care of yourself, exercise, eat right, keep regular hours, live in a healthy way, you can serve as a good example and may make it easier for him too also. Those things wouldn’t hurt you either, even though you’re not suffering from migraines. But I think one thing we (as migraneurs) can tell you is that when you’re in pain, you don’t feel like exercising. You don’t feel like reforming your life and taking on projects. I know I’ve read a million times that caffeine is a drug – I know it’s a vasoconstrictor, and that your body gets used to a certain level of it in your bloodstream and reacts to it being there, and reacts to the absence of it. To get off of caffeine would require me to go through at least a solid week of disabling headaches — I’ve tried and had to stop because I have to work and I wasn’t willing to devote a full week of vacation to detoxing from caffeine. My neurologist agreed that I might even wind up needing hospitalization from the headaches I would get if I go cold turkey off of caffeine. Sometimes people can hear advice a hundred times before they actually HEAR it too. Sometimes they have to be ready to listen to it. So as uncomfortable as it is, you can’t make your friend do anything. The only person’s behavior you can control is your own. You can suggest he try reading this newsgroup. Or you could print out the FAQ and leave it lying in the bathroom or something. And you could tell him (of course, this may be too touchy-feely for a guy) that it really hurts you when you see him having such a hard time and you worry about him, and you think there are some things he could be trying that might help him. And you’d appreciate him respecting your friendship enough to keep an open mind about trying some of those things. Good luck. Rosemary
Thanks for the reply Rosemary, I am glad that you mentioned that going off of caffeine could make my friend’s migraines worse, like it would for you, at least in the short run. In many ways my friend and I live opposite life styles, I do exercise often, have regular sleep habits, and I drink little caffeine. So i guess from setting a good example perspective, i’ve got that covered. Really i’m not looking to change him like that, I just read in the FAQ, and other places on the NET that many of these things are triggers, and that exercise for some people at least can reduce the frequency. I am happy to say that the other night, that we talked about this problem, and that he admitted that the ER is not a long term solution to his problem, and that he is making an oppointment with a specialist. He also admitted that he also fears becoming addicted to pain killers. This really makes me happy, i’m really really hoping he sticks to what he said, and goes to see a specialist. I guess time will only tell though. Eric
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You could take the hard ass approach and tell your roomie no the next time he wants you to drive him to the ER. Or at least tell him "this is the last time unless…" Unless he seeks medical help for his headaches. I would not broach the subject about him possibly having an addiction to the ER experience although it sounds to me like this is whats happening. Tell him that there are drugs out there (some of them non-narcotic) that actually will help with headaches. I can attest to this, being a long term sufferer of cluster headaches. Also tell him that you care enough about him to help him through this but that your feeling helpless unless he does something more proactive for his medical problem. I think that he’ll not want to risk the relationship and will agree to take the first step. He needs to know that his use of the ER as a first step for his migraines is abuse. It should be the last step, after nothing else is working. Btw, you didnt mention whether your friend has health insurance. If he doesnt, be prepared for a very expensive journey. Typically, the medications that are used to treat headaches can be costly.
Yes, he does have health insurance, if he didn’t, he would have had to declare bankruptcy long before now, becuase of the number of times that he has gone. We also had a talk the other night, I think thing may be chaning for the better. I posted more info to another post in this thread. Thanks, Eric – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mark I’m at my wits end with my roomate and long time friend. My problem is how do I get my friend to want to get help for his migraines? Some bakckground here, I have known him most of my life, and he has had snip… Thanks, Eric Zimmerman ** Remove ".nospam" when replying or email will bounce back to you…
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This chap is fortunate to have a friend like you. Unfortunately, by aiding and abetting him in his drug runs you are probably enabling this behaviour. It may just be time for you to tell him of your concerns and let him know that you’ll drive him to neuro and doctor’s appointments, but not to the emerg, (unless he breaks a leg or something!). I’d like to suggest a less-judgmental conversation and, hopefully, solution. Is there any way to go with him to his next neuro appt? The three of you can then put together an agreement for your rommie’s pain management. His neuro may or may not be aware of the ER trips. You have become involved in his pain relief, and you have a right to be part of the decision. Please understand that your friend is most likely in a great deal of pain. He wants to be out of pain, and the only thing he knows gets him there at this point is an ER shot of Demerol. Demerol is available in pill form, and it can be compounded into a suppository form at a compounding pharmacy (those work great for those who have puking migraines.) The neuro could set a limit per month and maybe would be willing to give him something else a little less potent for the rest of the time. Demerol is still the only medication that actually renders me pain-free…and that’s about a one-in-five shots situation. Even if your roomie is not abusing the medication, you may find some help in Al-Anon (there are newsgroups available on-line.) It helps you learn what your boundaries are…should be…ought to be. You decide for yourself what is helping a man in pain vs. facilitating drug abuse. Meds and drugs are the same pills…the difference is why you take them. My husband and i stay active in Al-Anon, as we treat my pain as an addict and not let the pain direct all of my life. I should add that i am also a recovering addict/alcoholic. Treating my pain is a very delicate matter. Please know that my husband would be glad to exchange personal e-mails with you if that would be any help. He has been EXACTLY where you are. This spot is an ugly place to be, but you can get to do-able from here. Deep peace, Lavon
Thanks Lavon, I talked at length with him about his migraines the other night. I think it went really well. I told him that I really feared that he was getting to much drugs and that he really can’t live like this forever. I was surprised when he said that he agreed with me, and that he was also afraid that he may become an addict. The next day, he called a specialist and made an appointment. For the first time in the last 6 months, I really feel like he is moving forward and has a real change in attitude about how he is going to deal with the migraines. At this time, I am really really hoping that he will follow through with going to the specialist, and follows through with the things the specialist tells him. One thing is for certain, i’m going to point him to this news group. I want to say that this is with out a doubt the best news group that I have ever read and posted to, the FAQ is great, the posts here are supportive and really informative. I want to thank everyone that responded to me here and also e-mail, after reading everything I really felt for the first time that my friend doesn’t have to be on a one way ticket to homeless drug addict. Thanks again, Eric
Response:
Judgmental? I would expect someone with an AA background to understand the importance of naming the behaviour and not entering into a "co-dependent" relationship with someone who is clearly abusing demerol. (Re-read the original post!)
I understand the danger of diagnosing/naming an illness or behaviour over the internet. Lavon
Response:
I haven’t noticed much restraint on your part in previous posts. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Judgmental? I would expect someone with an AA background to understand the importance of naming the behaviour and not entering into a "co-dependent" relationship with someone who is clearly abusing demerol. (Re-read the original post!) I understand the danger of diagnosing/naming an illness or behaviour over the internet. Lavon
Response:
Judgmental? I would expect someone with an AA background to understand the importance of naming the behaviour and not entering into a "co-dependent" relationship with someone who is clearly abusing demerol. (Re-read the original post!) I’ve spent many years working with psychiatric patients, people with addictions, people with PTSD and those with more general relationship problems both within and without the military. I’ve learned a coupe of things. The most important of which is, especially in this case, that Eric is not responsible for his roommate. Eric is not his mother – he is a friend and roommate. The Roommate is an adult who needs to examine, own and alter his own behaviour. Until this happens he will continue to use the neuro as a means of supporting the demerol use. I don’t know what level of confrontation needs to take place, but Eric does the fellow no good at all by continuing to drive him to the emerg when there is clearly no desire to change the drug seeking behaviour. Only after the roommate comes to the realization that he’s on an unhelpful – perhaps even self-destructive – path, will there be any point in asking to be involved with neuro consults, etc. Sure he’s in a lot of pain. Aren’t we all in here? But most of us aren’t abusing emergency services like this chap. There is clearly a problem. Eric recognizes it and has asked for help. Don’t tell him that it’s on his shoulders to become part of the roommate’s treatment plan, etc. Alex – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This chap is fortunate to have a friend like you. Unfortunately, by aiding and abetting him in his drug runs you are probably enabling this behaviour. It may just be time for you to tell him of your concerns and let him know that you’ll drive him to neuro and doctor’s appointments, but not to the emerg, (unless he breaks a leg or something!). I’d like to suggest a less-judgmental conversation and, hopefully, solution. Is there any way to go with him to his next neuro appt? The three of you can then put together an agreement for your rommie’s pain management. His neuro may or may not be aware of the ER trips. You have become involved in his pain relief, and you have a right to be part of the decision. Please understand that your friend is most likely in a great deal of pain. He wants to be out of pain, and the only thing he knows gets him there at this point is an ER shot of Demerol. Demerol is available in pill form, and it can be compounded into a suppository form at a compounding pharmacy (those work great for those who have puking migraines.) The neuro could set a limit per month and maybe would be willing to give him something else a little less potent for the rest of the time. Demerol is still the only medication that actually renders me pain-free…and that’s about a one-in-five shots situation. Even if your roomie is not abusing the medication, you may find some help in Al-Anon (there are newsgroups available on-line.) It helps you learn what your boundaries are…should be…ought to be. You decide for yourself what is helping a man in pain vs. facilitating drug abuse. Meds and drugs are the same pills…the difference is why you take them. My husband and i stay active in Al-Anon, as we treat my pain as an addict and not let the pain direct all of my life. I should add that i am also a recovering addict/alcoholic. Treating my pain is a very delicate matter. Please know that my husband would be glad to exchange personal e-mails with you if that would be any help. He has been EXACTLY where you are. This spot is an ugly place to be, but you can get to do-able from here. Deep peace, Lavon
Response:
Point your friend to this news group and let him read.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m at my wits end with my roomate and long time friend. My problem is how do I get my friend to want to get help for his migraines? Some bakckground here, I have known him most of my life, and he has had migraines for most of it. But the last 6 months have been completely insane! He gets one twice a week, and his life revolves around them. It is becoming a part time job for me just to take him back and forth to the hostpital, i’m not joking. Every time he goes to the hospital, he gets shot up with narcotics like demoral(sp?) or worse, and he constantly battles with the ER doctors to give him more. Often he comes home at night from one hospital and then goes to another one in the morning to get another shot. Some of the local ER’s here won’t give him anything anymore for the pain, because they think he is getting to much drugs, and i’m inclined to agree. I don’t actaully believe he goes just for the drugs, i believe that the headache is real, but how long can you take these drugs before your an addict? He is seeing a nueurologist, but i’m thinking that he goes there so that he can get a treatment plan to take to the ER so they will give him the drugs. At least that is how it is playing out so far. I’m certainly not a doctor, and maybe i shouldn’t be second guessing him, but i’ve not seen anything come of his work. My friend is a freelance artitist, and now does very little work, and is also suffering from depression maybe from the migraines, i don’t know. Now I can understand that he wants relief for the migraines, so he goes to the ER, but he doesn’t do anything to solve the problem long term. I have tried many many times to get him to take a more active role in finding a better solution to his migraines then narcotics, but he is uninterested, and I can’t get him to tell me why. I am really starting to feel guilty taking him to the hospital so he can get narcotics, sometimes the doctor comes in the waiting room, and asks me questions about my friend, questions that are obviously asked to determine if my friend is an addict, and i’m thinking he just might be one. I took a look at the FAQ for this newsgroup, and saw the list of possible triggers, my friend smokes, drinks tons of coffe and sodas, and has no sleep paterns to speek of, no exercise, and a bad diet. Maybe these things contribute to his problem, I don’t know, but I think they contribute to him not wanting to solve his problem. He may think that he would have to change his life style so drasticly to help his migraines that it is just easier to go to the ER. That is my theory anyway. Is there anyway I can get him to *try* to solve this in a better way then he is now? I’m *seriously* worried that in the not to distant future that he will be a homeless drug addict. Thanks, Eric Zimmerman
Response:
I’m at my wits end with my roomate and long time friend. My problem is how do I get my friend to want to get help for his migraines? Some bakckground here, I have known him most of my life, and he has had migraines for most of it. But the last 6 months have been completely insane! He gets one twice a week, and his life revolves around them. It is becoming a part time job for me just to take him back and forth to the hostpital, i’m not joking. Every time he goes to the hospital, he gets shot up with narcotics like demoral(sp?) or worse, and he constantly battles with the ER doctors to give him more. Often he comes home at night from one hospital and then goes to another one in the morning to get another shot. Some of the local ER’s here won’t give him anything anymore for the pain, because they think he is getting to much drugs, and i’m inclined to agree. I don’t actaully believe he goes just for the drugs, i believe that the headache is real, but how long can you take these drugs before your an addict? He is seeing a nueurologist, but i’m thinking that he goes there so that he can get a treatment plan to take to the ER so they will give him the drugs. At least that is how it is playing out so far. I’m certainly not a doctor, and maybe i shouldn’t be second guessing him, but i’ve not seen anything come of his work. My friend is a freelance artitist, and now does very little work, and is also suffering from depression maybe from the migraines, i don’t know. Now I can understand that he wants relief for the migraines, so he goes to the ER, but he doesn’t do anything to solve the problem long term. I have tried many many times to get him to take a more active role in finding a better solution to his migraines then narcotics, but he is uninterested, and I can’t get him to tell me why. I am really starting to feel guilty taking him to the hospital so he can get narcotics, sometimes the doctor comes in the waiting room, and asks me questions about my friend, questions that are obviously asked to determine if my friend is an addict, and i’m thinking he just might be one. I took a look at the FAQ for this newsgroup, and saw the list of possible triggers, my friend smokes, drinks tons of coffe and sodas, and has no sleep paterns to speek of, no exercise, and a bad diet. Maybe these things contribute to his problem, I don’t know, but I think they contribute to him not wanting to solve his problem. He may think that he would have to change his life style so drasticly to help his migraines that it is just easier to go to the ER. That is my theory anyway. Is there anyway I can get him to *try* to solve this in a better way then he is now? I’m *seriously* worried that in the not to distant future that he will be a homeless drug addict. Thanks, Eric Zimmerman
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