Question:
Adultchile wrote: > Like the recovery saying – "If you want to avoid backsliding, stay out of > slippery places"
Sorry, I forgot one thing. The impression I had from Nancy and Risa was that family members put pressure on them to behave in certain ways — being counterproductive to their recovery. I forget which one, but one did use a phrase that seemed to say that they no longer behaved that way, and no longer wanted to either. I’m still not clear by your response what those actions/behaviours would be.
Response:
tarasoff can be pretty subjective. it relies on the doctor’s judgement which leaves it open for abuse (as does most everything that is subjective). it also encompasses things that aren’t always overt. i remember one of my colleagues invoking tarasoff with a hypomanic social worker. she was admitted and not necessarily a danger to herself but she was planning on going back to work (without meds b/c she didn’t think she was even hypomanic). she was inappropriate at times and tended to be hypersexual. the judge committed her as a danger to others b/c of the damage she may do to a patient of hers through her hypersexuality. i myself had a psych unit once try to commit me b/c of my weight which was funny b/c i was 10 pounds heavier than when i came onto that unit and i was still eating (i am anorexic). they didn’t want to deal with me anymore and thought i was a danger to myself so they couldn’t just release me. their solution was to invoke tarasoff. luckily the hospital they sent me to released me a few hours later. and yes, docs aren’t great at admitting to mistakes.
Response:
Adultchile wrote: > miss my family? No, what I miss is the ideal of a family I never had. > That’s a lot harder one to give up. When I see people who grew up entitled to > a "nice" family, I feel disadvantaged. When I still have to learn > communications skills that those people grew up with, I feel cheated.
It makes me angry that you’re experiences aren’t that rare, and that you had to go through them. Believe me, you didn’t deserve any of it. I’m curious about the ideal of a nice family though. Where does that develop in the midst of what you grew up in?
Response:
>id my old Dr. was referring to what is called the Tarasoft (sic) >Act or Law
that would be the tarasoff act which was a supreme court decision in 1974 that ruled that a therapist has a legal obligation to act if a patient is felt to be either a danger to him/herself or a danger to a third party. it’s also known as duty to warn and is one of the few cases in which patient doctor privilege can be violated.
Response:
Lea, Everything okay? You haven’t been posting recently.
Response:
>With the exception of one sister, I haven’t had >familial contact in about 20 years. So, pardon the >prying, but I’m curious what family members would >be insisting/expecting people do that is >counter-productive to recovery.
Think back twenty-one years ago, and you’ll answer your own question. In my family, any gathering would consist of biting my tongue, or being invalidated by the same people wallowing in denial and active acting out. That’s not a safe environment for anyone. I’d be willing to bet the pressures put upon you were similar, if not in specifics, then in outcome. I’d rather be messed up on my own than messed up with people who pretend all that dysfunction is perfectly alright. Like the recovery saying – "If you want to avoid backsliding, stay out of slippery places"
Response:
Adultchile wrote: > >With the exception of one sister, I haven’t had > >familial contact in about 20 years. So, pardon the > >prying, but I’m curious what family members would > >be insisting/expecting people do that is > >counter-productive to recovery. > Think back twenty-one years ago, and you’ll answer your own question. In my > family, any gathering would consist of biting my tongue, or being invalidated > by the same people wallowing in denial and active acting out.
That wasn’t the case, at least entirely. There were definite problems, but I also do have good memories — even of two abusers. Which is why this seems so strange to me. And that is especially true of extended family. I don’t remember ever having difficulties with aunts, uncles, and cousins. Family get togethers were jovial. People talked, laughed, drank. There weren’t any ongoing feuds. It’s as though they were all casual acquaintance that just came and went. > That’s not a safe environment for anyone. I’d be willing to bet the pressures > put upon you were similar, if not in specifics, then in outcome. I’d rather be > messed up on my own than messed up with people who pretend all that dysfunction > is perfectly alright.
What I hear differently in your comments, than in the thoughts in my head, is that you would still prefer that family connection. I’ve spent a number of years bandying this about. I just seem to be missing a piece that explains my total indifference to these people. Years ago there was anger, and what not. Now, it’s nothing. Easter is approaching. Just something that brings me back to this little puzzle.
Response:
User40Cal wrote: > Maybe one day when I feel comfortable I will bring up my dad and the link > to his website. > This would provide insight into the type of calls I was receiving from him. > That’s a whole new deep matter and probably off topic.
This newsgroup is not just about medication, therapy, and symptoms, in case you wondered. Many people talk about their triggers, what triggers them, the reactions, realtionships, any issue really. Many of us hope that you’ll talk more about your thoughts and feelings in relation to the situation, rather the other person who isn’t here to defend themselves, or part of the recovery. Giving yourself distance from those who create difficulty in your life is understandable, however, ptsd-ers go to extremes (as you know) and end up isolating ourselves even more. We’re the ones who are hurt by this and pay an incredible price the longer it stays in place. As for your family, part of the problem of being there and always taking care of people is that they expect it. They grow dependent on us. Even when your depressed as hell, and have trouble coping with getting out of bed they can’t see past the end of their problems. Selfish, or not, you have to be able to care for yourself before you can be any good to other people — at least without suffering immeasurable for the effort. Glad, again, that you’re reaching out.
Response:
Hi Cal! > My family wants to communicate with me, but they stress me out!
Once we decide to help ourselves, instead of playing all the family ‘emotional games’, their whole universe changes. In my case, I keep getting ‘change back’ messages because their lives are more predictable _to them_ if I don’t make changes for recovery. > My family has "issues" as well but they are not related to my PTSD and they > have not made > any attempts to understand my disorder
If the members of my family make no effort towards helping me, but continue to expect me to help them, then I understand quite clearly that they depend upon my active PTSD symptoms to keep them ‘feeling good’ about themselves. This is their problem, not mine, but it has been difficult for me to internalize and then act on this notion. It is _very_ difficult to end the family ‘game’ of ‘dump on Nancy’, and I’m still struggling with it … after 10 years of therapy and meds. ??? I think that people who can end this ‘game’ early are in much better shape than I. I applaud their resolve and ability. For years I’ve been waiting for various people to comprehend me and trying to ‘fit in’ as much as possible with their expectations of me. It has been to no avail. YMMV, of course Smile and there will be something to smile about! Nancy
Response:
Nancy <ki…@cris.com> wrote in message
news:97tl3c$jeo@dispatch.concentric.net… > Once we decide to help ourselves, instead of playing all the family > ‘emotional games’, their whole universe changes. In my
case, I keep getting > ‘change back’ messages because their lives are more
predictable _to them_ if > I don’t make changes for recovery.
I got better and they got mad at me. It took me a while to figure out what h*** was going on. My sisters could not handle me being well and I got the same messages to change back. Thank ghod I have a very sane hubby who was/is very supportive. Margaret
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -margaret szedenits wrote: > Nancy <ki…@cris.com> wrote in message > news:97tl3c$jeo@dispatch.concentric.net… > > Once we decide to help ourselves, instead of playing all > the family > > ‘emotional games’, their whole universe changes. In my > case, I keep getting > > ‘change back’ messages because their lives are more > predictable _to them_ if > > I don’t make changes for recovery. > I got better and they got mad at me. It took me a while to > figure out what h*** was going on. My sisters could not > handle me being well and I got the same messages to change > back.
With the exception of one sister, I haven’t had familial contact in about 20 years. So, pardon the prying, but I’m curious what family members would be insisting/expecting people do that is counter-productive to recovery.
Response:
User40Cal wrote: > x-no-archive: yes > Thanks, I responded to your email. By using the word embarrassing I do not > mean to > disparage fellow sufferers, I mean that it is not something that my > family/friends > can relate and or understand. Those that I still speak with anyway. Since > being > DX’d with PTSD I have become a loner and prefer it that way.
I don’t believe you for a minute. Being alone and isolated is definitely better than the reactions of being out in the world at risk, but I don’t want to be isolated. I never did. It was just easier. Somehow, I just think it’s the same for everyone here. After all, and to be blunt, if being alone and isolated weren’t a problem then you wouldn’t have reached out to this group. I’m glad you did.
Response:
User40Cal wrote: > x-no-archive: yes > I reached out to the group, but that does not mean I am in communications > with my family (which is definitely not me) and therefore is abnormal. > We were speaking daily, now I have their numbers blocked from calling here. > Thanks for having me.
You’re welcome. I thought we were talking about being a loner as a result of ptsd, not your family. I didn’t have to go to the expense of call-block. It seems when my father was convicted of assault and weapons dangerous (and had his sentence suspended) that most of my family wanted nothing to do with me.
Response:
Hi Max! > My PTSD Doctor says they are not nightmares but "night terrors."
If your PTSD doctor has a ‘name’ for a symptom, then you are not the only one with this symptom. :/ ————snip ——————— > Thanks for listening. It’s quite > embarrassing.
What’s embarassing? PTSD or one of its symptoms? In either case, _it_ is simply a normal reaction to one or more abnormal events. Nothing to be embarrassed about … these are very normal reactions. :/ > All this wandering has got me wondering > Where Christ is in all this Crisis?
My answer is: in all the good we can find around us. Finding the good is a little difficult sometimes with PTSD, but it is there if we can see it. Smile and there will be something to smile about! Nancy
Response:
User40Cal wrote: > Thanks for listening. Please only respond via email. It’s quite > embarrassing.
Therw were so many things to focus on in your post, and I chose this. Embarrassment is completely natural. Ptsd, symptoms, and reactions do set us apart. We feel and are singled out at times because of it. Talking about this in private only enhances the belief that we have to hide because of who we are and what we have to contend with. It serves to isolate us more. Your e-mail handle gives you anonymity, so please post to the group and expect responses from the group. I think you’ll find that many of us have experienced this same feeling in many situations. My future posts will be to the group. I hope you stay around to post and read.
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