Trauma – PTSD

Question:

Hello and welcome to asd, Drewe. My advice is to suggest that she see a physician to rule out anything physical that may be causing this bc there are _plenty!_ of physical conditions that can cause memory lapses.  Assuming or even leaping to the idea that this is caused bc she is multiple seems rash to me.  Your previous experience may have no relevance to what’s going on for her … and it may, suggest letting a d*ctor help her figure in figuring it out. SofT

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a friend who i only see about once or twice a month so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago so I understand how it is. She seems unaware of it except she’s starting to notice that people say things to her about conversations they have had with her that she doesn’t remember at all. She’s young so its not alzheimers or something like that. And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help? She seems genuine confused about why people are talking to her about conversations she doesn’t remember having. I don’t like the idea of being the one to break it to her that she might be multiple. I can’t imagine what that would do to someone who wasn’t prepared to hear it. I’m not sure if I can ignore the situation though because we both belong to an organization which requires our attention and memories to be good. Drewe

Response:

I have a friend who i only see about once or twice a month so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago so I understand how it is. She seems unaware of it except she’s starting to notice that people say things to her about conversations they have had with her that she doesn’t remember at all. She’s young so its not alzheimers or something like that. And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help? She seems genuine confused about why people are talking to her about conversations she doesn’t remember having. I don’t like the idea of being the one to break it to her that she might be multiple. I can’t imagine what that would do to someone who wasn’t prepared to hear it. I’m not sure if I can ignore the situation though because we both belong to an organization which requires our attention and memories to be good. Drewe

Response:

Hello and welcome to asd, Drewe. My advice is to suggest that she see a physician to rule out anything physical that may be causing this bc there are _plenty!_ of physical conditions that can cause memory lapses.  Assuming or even leaping to the idea that this is caused bc she is multiple seems rash to me.  Your previous experience may have no relevance to what’s going on for her … and it may, suggest letting a d*ctor help her figure in figuring it out.

Ok, I _know_ I can make coherent sentences and I have no idea how _that one_ slipped by me!  :O)  I meant to say, suggest letting a d*ctor help her in figuring this out.   :O) SofT – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – SofT I have a friend who i only see about once or twice a month so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago so I understand how it is. She seems unaware of it except she’s starting to notice that people say things to her about conversations they have had with her that she doesn’t remember at all. She’s young so its not alzheimers or something like that. And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help? She seems genuine confused about why people are talking to her about conversations she doesn’t remember having. I don’t like the idea of being the one to break it to her that she might be multiple. I can’t imagine what that would do to someone who wasn’t prepared to hear it. I’m not sure if I can ignore the situation though because we both belong to an organization which requires our attention and memories to be good. Drewe

Response:

Please be careful about self-diagnosing your friend.  There are a lot of physical and psychological illnesses that can cause forgetting things and DID is only one of many.  I would refer your friend to her primary care physician.  She should have a complete physical first, to rule out any neurological, physiological or physical illness that is causing the forgetting.  If that is not the case, then the doctor can refer her to a good psychiatrist or psychologist for evaluation.  Just because you were DID and see similarities does not mean your friend is DID.  Even if she is dissociating, it does not mean she is DID.  Dissociation can occur in tandem with many other mental illnesses such as Borderline Personality Disorder, Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and many other disorders.  In addition, the memory lapses could be caused by other factors that do not include dissociating, such as seizues. The very best thing you can do for your friend is suggest she see a physician and start there. Michelle — "Wagner’s music is better than it sounds." – Mark Twain

Response:

hi i’m trill

I have a friend who i only see about once or twice a month

little time to know someone in an intimate and thorough way, maybe, i think so anyway. so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago

then, suddenly you became a singleton?  what?  i don’t get it.  more info please. so I understand how it is.

are you sure?  each and every person experiences life and its analogues and diversities differently from each and every other person.  imo, anyway, but i think a lot of people share my opinion. She seems unaware of it except she’s starting to notice that people say things to her about conversations they have had with her that she doesn’t remember at all. She’s young so its not alzheimers

uh uh.  i’ve seen alzheimers strike young people.  i’ve known young people who were close with me then got alzheimers and eventually died after several years of increasing dementia and declining independence. or something like that.

also i’ve seen "young" or maybe i should say "younger" people suffer other illnesses, diseases, disorders, whatever, that caused dementia and decline in them.  young like under fifty and sometimes as young as adolescence. And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help?

suggest full medical exams that include neurological workups and rheumatological work ups and complete blood work, and i mean complete — lyme disease, ms, stds, asl, seizure disorders, blood pressure, etc.  also suggest psychothrpy while sie goes through all of that even if it is just to learn to/help hir to cope with all the exams and findings, if any. She seems genuine confused about why people are talking to her about conversations she doesn’t remember having. I don’t like the idea of being the one to break it to her that she might be multiple.

then don’t be because you don’t know.  but you can and should tell hir that you have observed what you’ve observed and therefore become concerned about hir.  offer hir your support.  you can maybe offer to and then be there to go through with it, to help find doctors and to go to appts with hir and advocate for hir because health care system sucks and sie will probably be treated badly and will also probably feel terrified and need someone to help. I can’t imagine what that would do to someone who wasn’t prepared to hear it. I’m not sure if I can ignore the situation though because we both belong to an organization which requires our attention and memories to be good.

oh yeah.  me too.  mine is called "human life on earth." trill – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Drewe

Response:

i chuckled just a bit inside as i read the subject of your post, because i have a list of people in my life whom i believe may be multiple.  my list is annotated to reflect the level of involvement i have in helping them with this. at least one person on the list is someone i believe i should not have any involvement with helping them with what i suspect is their multiplicity.  most of the rest (there are anywhere between 5-8.  being multiple myself, any mental lists i have look different, depending on the day) are at varying stages of understanding their multiplicity. some of them i just talk to openly about how *i* am, making it seem as normal as possible, describing things in terms that don’t sound "crazy" (since that was a biiiiig factor in it taking 10 years for me to "figure out" that i really *was* multiple after figuring it out the first time and freaking out about it and burying the knowledge inside). some of them i’ve come out and said, after talking about myself in these terms and gauging their responses for their level of awareness of their own state, that it seems to me like there’s a chance they might be similar.  sometimes i’ve gone thru a list of questions that, by themselves, may not reflect whether a person is multiple or not.  but enough "positives" to enough of those questions makes a convincing argument that I can then say "you may want to go to a professional and get this checked out.  btw, there’s this *great* ng online i highly suggest you check out, too… " and one of them, to my surprise, already *knew* he was multiple, so all of my tact and subtlety went for naught. *wry grin at self*  he and i seem to make an effective healing team: we help each other.  it’s very cool.  :) so…dunno.  i can give you my personal "take" on multiplicity – ie: what i say when i’m explaining it to "norms" (or "singletons", if you’d prefer).  it tends to make the disorder more "approachable" to ppl who have visions of Sybil in their head or whatever. my "take" is this:  everyone has different facets of their personality.  everyone presents a different "face" to the world when they’re at work, for example, than when they’re at home relaxing, and than when they’re having fun with friends.  The phrase "get your game face on" is a perfect example of this.  Another familiar metaphor is to refer to which "hat" a person happens to be wearing at that time. are they wearing their "professional" hat (ie: their work persona), or their "personal" hat.  Please let me know if this isn’t sufficiently clear to you.  I can explain better, but won’t unless it’s not making sense. anyway, the only real difference between a person with multiple personalities and a person without them is the degree of separation between the different aspects of their personalities. CAVEAT:  I *know* that there are people on this newsgroup who believe differently.  i understand, and do not mean to imply that everyone with multiple personalities fits into my neat little theory.  However, when explaining to people who don’t have a clue, I try to go for the simplest level of explication, and can expand from there as needed. Ok, so back to my neat little theory: Sometimes i go into the "multiple memory storage" theory – where scientists believe that memories are stored in different parts of the brain, then reassembled into a coherent whole as needed.  essentially, all of the different aspects of an event are separated and stored in their appropriate part of the brain – the sound in the sound area, the visuals in the visuals area, the emotions in their own section, etc. – and then a "map" of where all of that information is stored is stored in the "maps" area of the brain.  The mind looks for the "map", then goes to the various parts of the brain picking up the info it needs to complete the memory. The theory goes that if a person experiences a traumatic event, the mind cannot process the whole memory at one time; ie, the "map" cannot be reassembled completely.  (one might assume this is a good enough definition of "dissociation", but i wouldn’t be such a one.)  Most ppl, however, are able to return to some more normal (to them) level of functioning over time, perhaps with some tx, etc. Children below a certain age, however, don’t have a strong enough sense of "self" to remain *essentially* unchanged. Their minds store the traumatic memory differently, but they lose (or never quite develop) the ability to store non-traumatic memories and recall them in full. My theory (i’ve already explained far more than I usually do to most ppl who aren’t multiple, or believe they aren’t multiple) continues with personality development:  while people seem to be born with predispositions to certain personality traits, most personality traits develop as a result of a person’s experiences in life.  A person who gets bitten by a dog may develop a dislike of dogs, for example. So here’s the part of the theory that’s uniquely mine:  When a person with multiple personalities accesses the "sounds" part of their memories, they have all the memories they’ve stored there, but don’t have complete access to other parts of the memory.  So their sense of self, or their personality, is going to be influenced what they *do* remember.  If that person then switches, and accesses memories focused more on emotions and fears, their memories will be different, and thus they will *feel* distinctly different from when that person was accessing the "sounds" part of the memory. make sense?  or did i lose you a looong time ago?  ;) either one is fine.  i just need to know so that i can either choose to keep blathering on endlessly, or shut up. so the *short* version is to say that the only real difference between a singleton and a multiple is that multiples don’t share memories across the various parts of themselves the same way that singletons are able to do.  so multiples feel like the different aspects of their personality are distinct because they remember different things across the switches. anyways, this is how i explain multiple personalities to ppl who don’t have a basic understanding of it already, with lots of caveats regarding the fact that this is *my* pet theory, and doesn’t hold true for all multiples. i’ve found that when i explain it this way to someone i suspect might be multiple, there’s a look they get on their face like a lightbulb went off somewhere in the *back* of their mind (rather than over their head.  ;) ), and i can see the tumblers fall into place as stuff starts to make sense that they hadn’t really let themselves be consciously aware of b4. …or so i think.  i have a rather inflated sense of self-importance, after all. *shrugs*  anyway, that’s what i do. good luck. jt

I have a friend who i only see about once or twice a month so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago so I understand how it is. She seems unaware of it except she’s starting to notice that people say things to her about conversations they have had with her that she doesn’t

remember at all. She’s young so its not alzheimers or something like that. And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help? She seems genuine confused about why people are

talking to her about – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – conversations she doesn’t remember having. I don’t like the idea of being the one to break it to her that she might be multiple. I can’t imagine what that would do to someone who wasn’t prepared to hear it. I’m not sure if I can ignore the situation though because we both belong to an organization which requires our attention and memories to be good. Drewe

Response:

She’s young so its not alzheimers or something like that.

Doesn’t follow.  Early-onset alzheimer’s can be very early onset. Baba Yaga — Anger, like love, is a moral emotion.  I have watched people use anger, in the name of emotional liberation, to erode affection and trust, whittle away their spirits in bitterness and revenge, diminish their dignity in years of spiteful hatred.  And I watch with admiration those who use anger to probe for truth, who challenge and change the complacent injustices of life, who take an unpopular position center stage while others say "shhhh" from the wings.                                             Carol Tavris

Response:

so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she

is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago<< then, suddenly you became a singleton?  what?  i don’t get it.  more info

please.< That’s kind of a long story, so I’ll give the abbreviated version unless someone really needs to know the whole thing. I am transsexual. I didn’t know or suspect that until I was around 43. In researching and trying to figure out whether that might be true or not I found that I had at least two personalities, a female one (matching the body I was born with) and a male one. (Maybe more than one female one). I thought for several years that the male one was an extra and the female one was the "real me". I was aware of when I switched. I didn’t have any control over it, and I guess I had "co-consciousness" because when one personality was in control I was vaguely aware of the other like it was far away in the background (sort of). One day about three years or so after I realized I was multiple, during a VERY stressful time of my life, I got stuck between personalities. That lasted about two or three days, and it felt horrible! Like I was sort of vibrating but not one or the other and kind of like I was no one, or no where. That settled down again, but it made me realize that I wasn’t sure who the real me was. I went away to a hotel for a couple of days and carefully reviewed my whole life starting with my earliest memory. (Like i  imagine a T would do). Somehow in that process I suddenly (yes very suddenly) became aware that I was alone, and that I was really male. I felt the female one was gone for good, but I wasn’t sure for a while. I normally switched anywhere from a couple times a day to once every week or two. When several months had gone by and no switching I was pretty sure it was gone. Now its been about 3 1/2 years and still no more switching. I did finally see a T about my gender identity and told him about the DID but he never seemed interested since it was in the past and he wasn’t having to deal with it. And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help?

suggest full medical exams that include neurological workups and rheumatological work ups and complete blood work, and i mean complete — lyme disease, ms, stds, asl, seizure disorders, blood pressure, etc.  also suggest psychothrpy while sie goes through all of that even if it is just to learn to/help hir to cope with all the exams and findings, if any.<< I think I’m only going to be able to suggest something if she comes out and says to me that she’s scared or is actually asking for help. So far she’s just confused once in a while but hasn’t even said, ‘I wonder why I don’t remember that?" Anyway, thanks Tril, and all the others that offered suggestions and ideas. I’ll let you know if I find out anything further about her situation. Drewe

Response:

Hi jt, thanks for your really long detailed explanation on how you explain to people about being multiple. I *think* I even understood it I probably won’t be seeing my friend for a few more weeks, but I’m keeping all the ideas people have written here in mind for when I do see her. I probably can’t say anything at all to her unless she brings up the topic again. I don’t know if I explained it well enough before. She’s in her late 20’s. I see her once a month but e-mail back and forth with her a couple times a week. Sometimes I’ll get two completely different answers to the same e-mail (as if two different people were writing back). A couple of times she has said that people say things to her, or about her that don’t make any sense to her at all (things that she has supposedly said and done, but they don’t sound familiar to her). I guess I’ll just have to wait and see if there are any more developments. Drewe

Response:

Wow, and well!     Okay, Drewe, _your_ story fascinates me.  I invite and suggest to you that you stick around asd.  I think that you’ll like it here, find the info shared among us interesting at least and informative and helpful at most. plse scroll:

so its taken a while to realize this – but i am pretty convinced now she is multiple. I was myself up until three years ago<< then, suddenly you became a singleton?  what?  i don’t get it.  more info please.< That’s kind of a long story, so I’ll give the abbreviated version unless someone really needs to know the whole thing. I am transsexual.

    I don’t know how long you’ve lurked here, or when, but more than one transexual has passed through and at least one is pretty much of a regular and one of our most, well at least one of my most, beloved and admired members.  Sie takes long periods off from participation due to a multitude of incredible difficulties in hir life, but when sie’s around sie is extremely active.     I’m queer myself, and we also have plenty of queer members.  I’m female, but i’ve got more than one male alter.  One of those is very active, frequently up front, and sharing a lot of memory and consciousness with me and others.  He’s very much into a team building approach. I didn’t know or suspect that until I was around 43.

    I was 45 when I figured out the whole multiple thing.  And that’s a long story, too; one that I won’t go into now.  But, you can probably piece it together at the archives via google.  And, later, if you want, I’ll be glad to share it with you, but perhaps privately, like if you write to me and we develop a correspondence that is independent of asd. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In researching and trying to figure out whether that might be true or not I found that I had at least two personalities, a female one (matching the body I was born with) and a male one. (Maybe more than one female one). I thought for several years that the male one was an extra and the female one was the "real me". I was aware of when I switched. I didn’t have any control over it, and I guess I had "co-consciousness" because when one personality was in control I was vaguely aware of the other like it was far away in the background (sort of). One day about three years or so after I realized I was multiple, during a VERY stressful time of my life, I got stuck between personalities. That lasted about two or three days, and it felt horrible! Like I was sort of vibrating but not one or the other and kind of like I was no one, or no where.

    I’ve had more than one experience like that.  I don’t like it at all. In fact, it frightens me.  Badly. That settled down again, but it made me realize that I wasn’t sure who the real me was.

Huh.  I think that all of us are "real."         There are times when I can’t hear from nor make contact with some or all of the others.  Some of those times have lasted years.  However, eventually I learned that everbody was still there, just that at times different ones recede into a deep and secret place inside of my internal geography and, for whatever reasons, refse to eard from.  I also learned that they come back, according to what K. Marx referred to as the freedom/necessity principal. I went away to a hotel for a couple of days and carefully reviewed my whole life starting with my earliest memory.

    Interesting method of psychothrpy.  I wonder if it would work for me. (Like i  imagine a T would do). Somehow in that process I suddenly (yes very suddenly) became aware that I was alone, and that I was really male. I felt the female one was gone for good, but I wasn’t sure for a while. I normally switched anywhere from a couple times a day to once every week or two. When several months had gone by and no switching I was pretty sure it was gone. Now its been about 3 1/2 years and still no more switching. I did finally see a T about my gender identity and told him about the DID but he never seemed interested since it was in the past and he wasn’t having to deal with it.

    From my perspective the t you saw isn’t astute enough about the operations of a mind of multiple personalities. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And besides not remembering large, important things she seems like different people at different times. Now the question is…what if anything can I do or say to help? suggest full medical exams that include neurological workups and rheumatological work ups and complete blood work, and i mean complete — lyme disease, ms, stds, asl, seizure disorders, blood pressure, etc.  also suggest psychothrpy while sie goes through all of that even if it is just to learn to/help hir to cope with all the exams and findings, if any.<< I think I’m only going to be able to suggest something if she comes out and says to me that she’s scared or is actually asking for help. So far she’s just confused once in a while but hasn’t even said, ‘I wonder why I don’t remember that?"

    What do you think would happen if you were to say to her, gently and tenderly with obvious care, compassion, and respect, something like, "I’ve observed this and that blah blah blah about your behavior and it sets off some few little alarms in my consciouness.  Would you be willing to try and find a t to help check things out?  I’ll help you look.  And also, these blah blah blah anomolies that I’ve observed in your behavior give me a little cause for concern about your general health.  I’ll help you look for a doctor who is thorough and respectful, I’ll even go with you and advocate for you." Anyway, thanks Tril, and all the others that offered suggestions and ideas. I’ll let you know if I find out anything further about her situation.

Okay.  I’m interested.  Amd I’m interested in you as well. trill – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Drewe

Response:

Hello Drewe, Does your friend know about your history being multiple? I ask bc when you describe what you observe in her, it sounds too (something) and I just had this thought and wondered if she does know, if she might be feigning the multiplicity in an effort to bond with you. Yeah, I know, a crazy thought but there it is.  Hmm, kinda feel like I’m broaching a very taboo subject bringing up the possibility of someone, your friend, feigning multiplicity. SofT

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi jt, thanks for your really long detailed explanation on how you explain to people about being multiple. I *think* I even understood it I probably won’t be seeing my friend for a few more weeks, but I’m keeping all the ideas people have written here in mind for when I do see her. I probably can’t say anything at all to her unless she brings up the topic again. I don’t know if I explained it well enough before. She’s in her late 20’s. I see her once a month but e-mail back and forth with her a couple times a week. Sometimes I’ll get two completely different answers to the same e-mail (as if two different people were writing back). A couple of times she has said that people say things to her, or about her that don’t make any sense to her at all (things that she has supposedly said and done, but they don’t sound familiar to her). I guess I’ll just have to wait and see if there are any more developments. Drewe

Response:

Does your friend know about your history being multiple?

I ask bc when you describe what you observe in her, it sounds too (something) and I just had this thought and wondered if she does know, if she might be feigning the multiplicity in an effort to bond with you. Yeah, I know, a crazy thought but there it is.  Hmm, kinda feel like I’m broaching a very taboo subject bringing up the possibility of someone, your friend, feigning multiplicity. SofT<< I can’t remember if she knows. I don’t think so, but its slightly possible. I think i didn’t meet her until after I got integrated (or whatever it was that happened). It crossed my mind that if she does know that maybe she expressed her confusion to me because she wants to talk about the subject. Or I guess its possible she could feign it….but to me that would mean a even stranger problem (DID doesn’t seem strange to me, in fact I kind of miss it since I still don’t know how "normal" people cope). Drewe

Response:

heh *embarrassed grin*  i, ahh…probably should have warned you that i talk a lot…  it’s mostly to hear myself think, but sometimes other ppl find a snippet in it that’s useful.  that’s a nice thing, when it happens.  ;) i hope things go well with your friend.  it’s tough when you want to help, but your avenues for helping are so limited by circumstances. i’ll keep you in my thoughts. jt

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi jt, thanks for your really long detailed explanation on how you explain to people about being multiple. I *think* I even understood it I probably won’t be seeing my friend for a few more weeks, but I’m keeping all the ideas people have written here in mind for when I do see her. I probably can’t say anything at all to her unless she brings up the topic again. I don’t know if I explained it well enough before. She’s in her late 20’s. I see her once a month but e-mail back and forth with her a couple times a week. Sometimes I’ll get two completely different answers to the same e-mail (as if two different people were writing back). A couple of times she has said that people say things to her, or about her that don’t make any sense to her at all (things that she has

supposedly said and done, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – but they don’t sound familiar to her). I guess I’ll just have to wait and see if there are any more developments. Drewe

Response:

<snip (DID doesn’t seem strange to me, in fact I kind of miss it since I still don’t know how "normal" people cope). Drewe

*giggles* we sometimes lately been going for a long time as just one person, kinda?  and sometimes whoever’s out can’t hear any voices inside.  it’s eerie. but the going as just one person doesn’t feel eerie – it just kinda happens, and we realize later (usually as a kid switches in and dissolves into giggles at the earliest "safe" opportunity, or some such.  ;) ) that "wow – we didn’t switch for, like, *hours* today." so that’s kinda neat. but it’s *really* weird not to hear voices inside.  it’s almost like the link gets passive or something?  the people on the other side can still pay attention to what’s going on, kinda, but they can’t *think* independently, if that makes sense. oh well…for whatever reason, my piano playing is improving.  i don’t know if there’s a connection, or even why i just said that, but…life’s going pretty well over here, and hopefully you can say the same, Drewe. nice talking with you! jt

Response:

Related Posts