Question:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -bobb wrote: > "WitchWirsen" <johncwir…@mchsi.com> wrote in message > news:XE99e.1351$NU4.1096@attbi_s22… > > "bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message > > news:mZGdnbfNOe6BnfjfRVn-3g@comcast.com… > >> "WitchWirsen" <johncwir…@mchsi.com> wrote in message > >> news:N_w8e.22319$xL4.20745@attbi_s72… > >>> "bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message > >>> news:erudnRSLCtZZnPzfRVn-sw@comcast.com… > >>>> What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon > >>>> to become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age? Seems to me > >>>> most families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year > >>>> old "adult" children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut > >>>> off his allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals. > >>> ‘Most’, is that like ‘many’? > >>> And you better bet your ass that ’some’ parents do! > >>> As a matter of fact, I was one of them. > >>>> The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal > >>>> responibilities should not end at an age they determine. If fact, it > >>>> used to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t > >>>> even finished high school at age 18… but.. so what. CPS rids itself > >>>> of another problem and seeks other little kids… some like a > >>>> predator, wouldn’t you say? > >>> So what you are saying is that DFS seeks out kids to keep in foster care > >>> until they turn 18. then they dump their asses out on the street with no > >>> money, no feed and nowhere to go, and then look for more kids to keep > >>> for the funding until they turn 18, rolling over and over again? > >>> Absurd. > >> If that seems harsh… just think about it. Isn’t that exactly what CPS > >> does? > >> It’s a self-serving organization. They do a great job in worse case > >> situations > >> but please recognize those are the costly ones… and because of the few > >> numbers in need… a massive budget would be impossible to justify. > > So you are saying that the MAJORITY of kids within families that have DFS > > involvement have cases open simply to justify the funding for children who > > are severely abused? > If one kid in the family is ’severely’ abused or not.. the rest of the kids > are > removed as well.
That’s correct. > Not for any danger but as a matter of convenience.
That’s a lie. It’s for the safety of the children and the integrety of witness for the investigation. Where did you get the idea the if a family is being investigated for abuse or neglect CPS knows by magic the other kids aren’t being abused or neglected? > So… for each kid removed "justifiably’ one, or two, or more, are removed > without reason and just cause.
Safety and investigation evidence and witness testimony integrety. And often what is found is that yes, indeed, other children than the child the abuse or neglect call was made on was in fact previously abused or neglected, and not found out at that time in the past. And indeed, very often the allegation is not on the one child, but in fact the caller often is concerned about other children in the family as well. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> > Boy, that ‘industry’ sure needs an overhaul…that’s just not cost > > effective, and any business owner will tell you that. > >> Even Kane falls victim to their bull. He thinks every kid removed from > >> home is in need of services while forgetting the kids in foster care did > >> nothing wrong. It was the parents who messed up. Some left their > >> kids alone too long… running to the quick mart, or having a clutter > >> house, > >> or engaged in very subjective behaviors CPS does not approve of. > >> Many kid would do better if not for current interventions when it means > >> disrupting entire families. > > Many again? > > How many is ‘many’? > Many… hmmm… as opposed to ‘most’? How about anyone, regardless of > numbers, who would do better without state intervention.
And proof they would have done better if they come from a household with an abuser in it? > Someone bantered > about the number of 96,000… and I would suppose that would be ‘many’, > right?
Yep. That would be many. Problem is that number did not pertain to those proven to have not been victims. And children that witness abuse are victimized by seeing it happen to their brothers and sisters. They don’t come into the data count, however. Or do you think a child that witnesses a parent batter a child, or otherwise injure them is free of psychological injury themselves? Imagine yourself trapped in a household this way. You, a child, who my NOT leave…and your daddy is fucking your sister regularly. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >>>> Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them > >>>> with ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an > >>>> allowance, clothes, and the promise of a better life without their > >>>> interferring parents. Sound familiar? > >>> It does NOT sound familiar to me. > >>> My daughter was one of those beyond parental control kids. > >>> She made a file folder full of DFS complaints against me for almost five > >>> years. > >>> My goal in life for those five years was to get her in control. > >>> DFS never once told that child that she could have a better life without > >>> interfering parents etc etc. > >>> What they told her was that *I* was the mom, and *SHE* was the kid and > >>> she would do as I told her or suffer her consequences. > >> Trouble, was… there were no consequences. No one followed though. Idle > >> threats. The kid was smarter than those around her. > > You think so? Exactly how would you know? > > Are you sure that no one followed through? > > Are you sure that she was smarter than everyone else? > > I can betcha 9 months in Delmina Wood says different. > >>> She once had a friend make a report that I had hit her with a broom > >>> When the worker arrived to investigate she asked if I had hit her with > >>> the broom. > >>> I said that I had, that I was sweeping the floor, and that she had > >>> called me a ‘bitch’ and when she did I tapped he on the leg with the > >>> broom handle. > >>> The worker asked to see her leg, did not see a mark, because I had not > >>> hit her hard at all, just TAPPED her to get her attention. > >>> And then she proceeded to give my daughter an hour long speech about how > >>> fortunate she was to live in a nice home, to have food on the table, and > >>> parents who cared enough about her to go out hunting for her all night > >>> when she didn’t come home on time, etc. > >>> I don’t recall the worker mentioning a ‘better’ place to live. > >>>> It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place > >>>> them in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ > >>>> being sexually abused. Actually, the risk so often mentioned by > >>>> CPS… rises to the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent. > >>> Ahhhh, yes, first teachers are fulfilling the fantasies of young boys by > >>> having sex with them and should be thanked, then sexual abuse is not > >>> sexual abuse nor is rape rape, and now homosexuals are potentially > >>> (more) a risk for abuse than anyone else. > >>> Please, do show me where DFS says that children of homosexual homes are > >>> at more risk of abuse. > >>> I have never seen such a thing. > >> Do you really think CPS would admit it? Hahahaha… of course not. It > >> wouldn’t be politicallly correct, would it? Picking on those poor queer > >> people… we just can’t have that. > > DFS has never admitted it? Even hinted at it? > > Are you sure it’s not just some kind of DFS ‘witch hunt’? > > Are you sure the media isn’t out for blood and the citizens of this > > country aren’t looking for anyone to blame but themselves? > >>>> If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child > >>>> endangerment, neglect, and abuse. > >>> And here I can agree with you. > >>> At time the actions of DFS, and even doctors and hospitals and > >>> therapists (mandated reporters) mimics the same behaviors that would > >>> warrant investigation of a parent. > >>> Fired one thrapist for behaviors that would have gotten my ass nailed, > >>> and threatened the whole pediatric staff at a local hospital with > >>> lawsuit for behaviors that would have gotten me founded by DFS for > >>> abuse, or at the least, neglect. > >>> But exactly what does that have to do with it? > >>> Does DFS charge parents who put out the 18 year old kid and refuse to > >>> take care of them? > >>> I highly doubt it Bob…show me, I’m from Missouri. Unless that child > >>> is mentally or physically unable to care for themselves…then no, prove > >>> it. > >>> Does DFs file against a parent who allows a child, for whatever reason, > >>> to live with a homosexual aunt or uncle or cousin for ‘risk of harm’? > >>> Hell no, if they do you show me where it’s happened. I KNOW that’s a > >>> lie. > >> Hmmm…. CPS will place a child in the care of a homosexual aunt, uncle, > >> or > >> stranger… that is true… but not with anyone on the sex register list. > > Would you? > Yep.
With a heterosexual someone in the sex register? Oh, goodie for you. But not with a homosexual who is NOT in the sex register? That’s quaint. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> >> Even > >> the 19 year old who had sex with his 16 year old girl friend. > > Lie. My newphew, Robert, was in the care of my father and step mother for > > a few years. > > My father has been convicted of statutory rape. > > He was exactly 19, had sex with his 16 year old GF, got her pregnant, her > > daddy got mad, filed a police report against my father, (the GF was my
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Response:
"WitchWirsen" <johncwir…@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:XE99e.1351$NU4.1096@attbi_s22… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message > news:mZGdnbfNOe6BnfjfRVn-3g@comcast.com… >> "WitchWirsen" <johncwir…@mchsi.com> wrote in message >> news:N_w8e.22319$xL4.20745@attbi_s72… >>> "bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message >>> news:erudnRSLCtZZnPzfRVn-sw@comcast.com… >>>> What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon >>>> to become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age? Seems to me >>>> most families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year >>>> old "adult" children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut >>>> off his allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals. >>> ‘Most’, is that like ‘many’? >>> And you better bet your ass that ’some’ parents do! >>> As a matter of fact, I was one of them. >>>> The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal >>>> responibilities should not end at an age they determine. If fact, it >>>> used to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t >>>> even finished high school at age 18… but.. so what. CPS rids itself >>>> of another problem and seeks other little kids… some like a >>>> predator, wouldn’t you say? >>> So what you are saying is that DFS seeks out kids to keep in foster care >>> until they turn 18. then they dump their asses out on the street with no >>> money, no feed and nowhere to go, and then look for more kids to keep >>> for the funding until they turn 18, rolling over and over again? >>> Absurd. >> If that seems harsh… just think about it. Isn’t that exactly what CPS >> does? >> It’s a self-serving organization. They do a great job in worse case >> situations >> but please recognize those are the costly ones… and because of the few >> numbers in need… a massive budget would be impossible to justify. > So you are saying that the MAJORITY of kids within families that have DFS > involvement have cases open simply to justify the funding for children who > are severely abused?
If one kid in the family is ’severely’ abused or not.. the rest of the kids are removed as well. Not for any danger but as a matter of convenience. So… for each kid removed "justifiably’ one, or two, or more, are removed without reason and just cause. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Boy, that ‘industry’ sure needs an overhaul…that’s just not cost > effective, and any business owner will tell you that. >> Even Kane falls victim to their bull. He thinks every kid removed from >> home is in need of services while forgetting the kids in foster care did >> nothing wrong. It was the parents who messed up. Some left their >> kids alone too long… running to the quick mart, or having a clutter >> house, >> or engaged in very subjective behaviors CPS does not approve of. >> Many kid would do better if not for current interventions when it means >> disrupting entire families. > Many again? > How many is ‘many’?
Many… hmmm… as opposed to ‘most’? How about anyone, regardless of numbers, who would do better without state intervention. Someone bantered about the number of 96,000… and I would suppose that would be ‘many’, right? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>> Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them >>>> with ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an >>>> allowance, clothes, and the promise of a better life without their >>>> interferring parents. Sound familiar? >>> It does NOT sound familiar to me. >>> My daughter was one of those beyond parental control kids. >>> She made a file folder full of DFS complaints against me for almost five >>> years. >>> My goal in life for those five years was to get her in control. >>> DFS never once told that child that she could have a better life without >>> interfering parents etc etc. >>> What they told her was that *I* was the mom, and *SHE* was the kid and >>> she would do as I told her or suffer her consequences. >> Trouble, was… there were no consequences. No one followed though. Idle >> threats. The kid was smarter than those around her. > You think so? Exactly how would you know? > Are you sure that no one followed through? > Are you sure that she was smarter than everyone else? > I can betcha 9 months in Delmina Wood says different. >>> She once had a friend make a report that I had hit her with a broom >>> When the worker arrived to investigate she asked if I had hit her with >>> the broom. >>> I said that I had, that I was sweeping the floor, and that she had >>> called me a ‘bitch’ and when she did I tapped he on the leg with the >>> broom handle. >>> The worker asked to see her leg, did not see a mark, because I had not >>> hit her hard at all, just TAPPED her to get her attention. >>> And then she proceeded to give my daughter an hour long speech about how >>> fortunate she was to live in a nice home, to have food on the table, and >>> parents who cared enough about her to go out hunting for her all night >>> when she didn’t come home on time, etc. >>> I don’t recall the worker mentioning a ‘better’ place to live. >>>> It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place >>>> them in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ >>>> being sexually abused. Actually, the risk so often mentioned by >>>> CPS… rises to the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent. >>> Ahhhh, yes, first teachers are fulfilling the fantasies of young boys by >>> having sex with them and should be thanked, then sexual abuse is not >>> sexual abuse nor is rape rape, and now homosexuals are potentially >>> (more) a risk for abuse than anyone else. >>> Please, do show me where DFS says that children of homosexual homes are >>> at more risk of abuse. >>> I have never seen such a thing. >> Do you really think CPS would admit it? Hahahaha… of course not. It >> wouldn’t be politicallly correct, would it? Picking on those poor queer >> people… we just can’t have that. > DFS has never admitted it? Even hinted at it? > Are you sure it’s not just some kind of DFS ‘witch hunt’? > Are you sure the media isn’t out for blood and the citizens of this > country aren’t looking for anyone to blame but themselves? >>>> If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child >>>> endangerment, neglect, and abuse. >>> And here I can agree with you. >>> At time the actions of DFS, and even doctors and hospitals and >>> therapists (mandated reporters) mimics the same behaviors that would >>> warrant investigation of a parent. >>> Fired one thrapist for behaviors that would have gotten my ass nailed, >>> and threatened the whole pediatric staff at a local hospital with >>> lawsuit for behaviors that would have gotten me founded by DFS for >>> abuse, or at the least, neglect. >>> But exactly what does that have to do with it? >>> Does DFS charge parents who put out the 18 year old kid and refuse to >>> take care of them? >>> I highly doubt it Bob…show me, I’m from Missouri. Unless that child >>> is mentally or physically unable to care for themselves…then no, prove >>> it. >>> Does DFs file against a parent who allows a child, for whatever reason, >>> to live with a homosexual aunt or uncle or cousin for ‘risk of harm’? >>> Hell no, if they do you show me where it’s happened. I KNOW that’s a >>> lie. >> Hmmm…. CPS will place a child in the care of a homosexual aunt, uncle, >> or >> stranger… that is true… but not with anyone on the sex register list. > Would you?
Yep. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Even >> the 19 year old who had sex with his 16 year old girl friend. > Lie. My newphew, Robert, was in the care of my father and step mother for > a few years. > My father has been convicted of statutory rape. > He was exactly 19, had sex with his 16 year old GF, got her pregnant, her > daddy got mad, filed a police report against my father, (the GF was my > step mother whom my father married) and the rest is history. > And yes, DFS KNEW that he had the charge and was convicted. > .. or even the >> nine year >> old who was found play doctor and labeled as a predator. In today’s age, >> I >> think any homosexual who even looks at a child wrong is asking to be put >> on someone’s list > Yeah, a list. Like the posts in this very NG about homosexuals who > foster? > …. hmmm… according to Kane… that could include >> heterosexuals, >> as well. We gotta watch out for those who truely care for kids.. .they >> are probably >> grooming them. > Are you denying that it happens? > Are you denying that people who molest and sexually abuse chidlren exist? > Are you denying that there are certain behaviors that could indicate who > is abusing or molesting children?
It’s not about denying anything.. but the numbers certainly do not warrant the out-rage, costs, or attention. Out of 300 million people, 500,00 are registered sex offenders… of all sorts… and most or not violent sexual incidents, either. There are ‘career’ criminal of every discrption… paid killers, life-time burglars and theives, con-men, and embezzlers… yet they get nary a spot in the media. Sex sells… that’s what it’s all about. It’s like the accident along side the road…everyone has to slow down and ’see’ what happened. Me. I speed up to make up for lost time. I ain’t got time for the trivial. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Let me tell you a story about a nice family guy. > He was respectedi n his community. > He was dedicated to his family. > He spent his free time working with a well known social organization, he > was active in church, and he did a great deal community service. > He acted as entertainer for kids at social events, and even visited local > hospitals to
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Response:
"bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message
news:mZGdnbfNOe6BnfjfRVn-3g@comcast.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "WitchWirsen" <johncwir…@mchsi.com> wrote in message > news:N_w8e.22319$xL4.20745@attbi_s72… >> "bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message >> news:erudnRSLCtZZnPzfRVn-sw@comcast.com… >>> What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon to >>> become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age? Seems to me most >>> families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year old >>> "adult" children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut off >>> his allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals. >> ‘Most’, is that like ‘many’? >> And you better bet your ass that ’some’ parents do! >> As a matter of fact, I was one of them. >>> The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal >>> responibilities should not end at an age they determine. If fact, it >>> used to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t even >>> finished high school at age 18… but.. so what. CPS rids itself of >>> another problem and seeks other little kids… some like a predator, >>> wouldn’t you say? >> So what you are saying is that DFS seeks out kids to keep in foster care >> until they turn 18. then they dump their asses out on the street with no >> money, no feed and nowhere to go, and then look for more kids to keep for >> the funding until they turn 18, rolling over and over again? >> Absurd. > If that seems harsh… just think about it. Isn’t that exactly what CPS > does? > It’s a self-serving organization. They do a great job in worse case > situations > but please recognize those are the costly ones… and because of the few > numbers in need… a massive budget would be impossible to justify.
So you are saying that the MAJORITY of kids within families that have DFS involvement have cases open simply to justify the funding for children who are severely abused? Boy, that ‘industry’ sure needs an overhaul…that’s just not cost effective, and any business owner will tell you that. > Even Kane falls victim to their bull. He thinks every kid removed from > home is in need of services while forgetting the kids in foster care did > nothing wrong. It was the parents who messed up. Some left their > kids alone too long… running to the quick mart, or having a clutter > house, > or engaged in very subjective behaviors CPS does not approve of. > Many kid would do better if not for current interventions when it means > disrupting entire families.
Many again? How many is ‘many’? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>> Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them >>> with ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an >>> allowance, clothes, and the promise of a better life without their >>> interferring parents. Sound familiar? >> It does NOT sound familiar to me. >> My daughter was one of those beyond parental control kids. >> She made a file folder full of DFS complaints against me for almost five >> years. >> My goal in life for those five years was to get her in control. >> DFS never once told that child that she could have a better life without >> interfering parents etc etc. >> What they told her was that *I* was the mom, and *SHE* was the kid and >> she would do as I told her or suffer her consequences. > Trouble, was… there were no consequences. No one followed though. Idle > threats. The kid was smarter than those around her.
You think so? Exactly how would you know? Are you sure that no one followed through? Are you sure that she was smarter than everyone else? I can betcha 9 months in Delmina Wood says different. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> She once had a friend make a report that I had hit her with a broom >> When the worker arrived to investigate she asked if I had hit her with >> the broom. >> I said that I had, that I was sweeping the floor, and that she had called >> me a ‘bitch’ and when she did I tapped he on the leg with the broom >> handle. >> The worker asked to see her leg, did not see a mark, because I had not >> hit her hard at all, just TAPPED her to get her attention. >> And then she proceeded to give my daughter an hour long speech about how >> fortunate she was to live in a nice home, to have food on the table, and >> parents who cared enough about her to go out hunting for her all night >> when she didn’t come home on time, etc. >> I don’t recall the worker mentioning a ‘better’ place to live. >>> It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place >>> them in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ >>> being sexually abused. Actually, the risk so often mentioned by >>> CPS… rises to the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent. >> Ahhhh, yes, first teachers are fulfilling the fantasies of young boys by >> having sex with them and should be thanked, then sexual abuse is not >> sexual abuse nor is rape rape, and now homosexuals are potentially (more) >> a risk for abuse than anyone else. >> Please, do show me where DFS says that children of homosexual homes are >> at more risk of abuse. >> I have never seen such a thing. > Do you really think CPS would admit it? Hahahaha… of course not. It > wouldn’t be politicallly correct, would it? Picking on those poor queer > people… we just can’t have that.
DFS has never admitted it? Even hinted at it? Are you sure it’s not just some kind of DFS ‘witch hunt’? Are you sure the media isn’t out for blood and the citizens of this country aren’t looking for anyone to blame but themselves? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>> If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child >>> endangerment, neglect, and abuse. >> And here I can agree with you. >> At time the actions of DFS, and even doctors and hospitals and therapists >> (mandated reporters) mimics the same behaviors that would warrant >> investigation of a parent. >> Fired one thrapist for behaviors that would have gotten my ass nailed, >> and threatened the whole pediatric staff at a local hospital with lawsuit >> for behaviors that would have gotten me founded by DFS for abuse, or at >> the least, neglect. >> But exactly what does that have to do with it? >> Does DFS charge parents who put out the 18 year old kid and refuse to >> take care of them? >> I highly doubt it Bob…show me, I’m from Missouri. Unless that child is >> mentally or physically unable to care for themselves…then no, prove it. >> Does DFs file against a parent who allows a child, for whatever reason, >> to live with a homosexual aunt or uncle or cousin for ‘risk of harm’? >> Hell no, if they do you show me where it’s happened. I KNOW that’s a >> lie. > Hmmm…. CPS will place a child in the care of a homosexual aunt, uncle, > or > stranger… that is true… but not with anyone on the sex register list.
Would you? > Even > the 19 year old who had sex with his 16 year old girl friend.
Lie. My newphew, Robert, was in the care of my father and step mother for a few years. My father has been convicted of statutory rape. He was exactly 19, had sex with his 16 year old GF, got her pregnant, her daddy got mad, filed a police report against my father, (the GF was my step mother whom my father married) and the rest is history. And yes, DFS KNEW that he had the charge and was convicted. .. or even the > nine year > old who was found play doctor and labeled as a predator. In today’s age, > I > think any homosexual who even looks at a child wrong is asking to be put > on someone’s list
Yeah, a list. Like the posts in this very NG about homosexuals who foster? …. hmmm… according to Kane… that could include > heterosexuals, > as well. We gotta watch out for those who truely care for kids.. .they > are probably > grooming them.
Are you denying that it happens? Are you denying that people who molest and sexually abuse chidlren exist? Are you denying that there are certain behaviors that could indicate who is abusing or molesting children? Let me tell you a story about a nice family guy. He was respectedi n his community. He was dedicated to his family. He spent his free time working with a well known social organization, he was active in church, and he did a great deal community service. He acted as entertainer for kids at social events, and even visited local hospitals to see sick children, and was the role model of a whole community. It was in the fall of 1978 that this dear man confessed to killing at least 30 young men, mostly teens, and buriying their remains in the crawl space of his home. And there you have the story of John Wayne Gacy. A ‘heterosexual’ man with a wife and kids, who just happened to like to have sex with teen boys and then kill them and bury them under his house. But while he was not pusuing his interests in sexual assault, he was volunteering to dress up like a clown and entertain sick kids, hosting block parties, etc. Great guy. And there are more of them out there. Well, I gotta admit… I ‘groomed’ all of my kids. Bought > them > presents, did nice things for them and with them, spent a lotta time with > them. > We talked about… ohmygosh… sex. We even slept together (will I go > to > jail with Micheal jackson) on occassion. Terrible person that I am, did > much > the same with my neices and nephews, too. Apply their ‘risk assessment’ > to > me and I’d fail for sure. I even swatted one young feller up aside the > head… > certainly a jailable offense these days.
One difference, you didn’t molest any of them, did you? And do you really think that no one was looking for signs of that while you were rearing those kids? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> bobb >>> bobb
Response:
"WitchWirsen" <johncwir…@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:N_w8e.22319$xL4.20745@attbi_s72… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message > news:erudnRSLCtZZnPzfRVn-sw@comcast.com… >> What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon to >> become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age? Seems to me most >> families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year old >> "adult" children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut off >> his allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals. > ‘Most’, is that like ‘many’? > And you better bet your ass that ’some’ parents do! > As a matter of fact, I was one of them. >> The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal >> responibilities should not end at an age they determine. If fact, it >> used to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t even >> finished high school at age 18… but.. so what. CPS rids itself of >> another problem and seeks other little kids… some like a predator, >> wouldn’t you say? > So what you are saying is that DFS seeks out kids to keep in foster care > until they turn 18. then they dump their asses out on the street with no > money, no feed and nowhere to go, and then look for more kids to keep for > the funding until they turn 18, rolling over and over again? > Absurd.
If that seems harsh… just think about it. Isn’t that exactly what CPS does? It’s a self-serving organization. They do a great job in worse case situations but please recognize those are the costly ones… and because of the few numbers in need… a massive budget would be impossible to justify. Even Kane falls victim to their bull. He thinks every kid removed from home is in need of services while forgetting the kids in foster care did nothing wrong. It was the parents who messed up. Some left their kids alone too long… running to the quick mart, or having a clutter house, or engaged in very subjective behaviors CPS does not approve of. Many kid would do better if not for current interventions when it means disrupting entire families. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them with >> ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an allowance, >> clothes, and the promise of a better life without their interferring >> parents. Sound familiar? > It does NOT sound familiar to me. > My daughter was one of those beyond parental control kids. > She made a file folder full of DFS complaints against me for almost five > years. > My goal in life for those five years was to get her in control. > DFS never once told that child that she could have a better life without > interfering parents etc etc. > What they told her was that *I* was the mom, and *SHE* was the kid and she > would do as I told her or suffer her consequences.
Trouble, was… there were no consequences. No one followed though. Idle threats. The kid was smarter than those around her. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> She once had a friend make a report that I had hit her with a broom > When the worker arrived to investigate she asked if I had hit her with the > broom. > I said that I had, that I was sweeping the floor, and that she had called > me a ‘bitch’ and when she did I tapped he on the leg with the broom > handle. > The worker asked to see her leg, did not see a mark, because I had not hit > her hard at all, just TAPPED her to get her attention. > And then she proceeded to give my daughter an hour long speech about how > fortunate she was to live in a nice home, to have food on the table, and > parents who cared enough about her to go out hunting for her all night > when she didn’t come home on time, etc. > I don’t recall the worker mentioning a ‘better’ place to live. >> It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place >> them in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ >> being sexually abused. Actually, the risk so often mentioned by CPS… >> rises to the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent. > Ahhhh, yes, first teachers are fulfilling the fantasies of young boys by > having sex with them and should be thanked, then sexual abuse is not > sexual abuse nor is rape rape, and now homosexuals are potentially (more) > a risk for abuse than anyone else. > Please, do show me where DFS says that children of homosexual homes are at > more risk of abuse. > I have never seen such a thing.
Do you really think CPS would admit it? Hahahaha… of course not. It wouldn’t be politicallly correct, would it? Picking on those poor queer people… we just can’t have that. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child >> endangerment, neglect, and abuse. > And here I can agree with you. > At time the actions of DFS, and even doctors and hospitals and therapists > (mandated reporters) mimics the same behaviors that would warrant > investigation of a parent. > Fired one thrapist for behaviors that would have gotten my ass nailed, and > threatened the whole pediatric staff at a local hospital with lawsuit for > behaviors that would have gotten me founded by DFS for abuse, or at the > least, neglect. > But exactly what does that have to do with it? > Does DFS charge parents who put out the 18 year old kid and refuse to take > care of them? > I highly doubt it Bob…show me, I’m from Missouri. Unless that child is > mentally or physically unable to care for themselves…then no, prove it. > Does DFs file against a parent who allows a child, for whatever reason, to > live with a homosexual aunt or uncle or cousin for ‘risk of harm’? Hell > no, if they do you show me where it’s happened. I KNOW that’s a lie.
Hmmm…. CPS will place a child in the care of a homosexual aunt, uncle, or stranger… that is true… but not with anyone on the sex register list. Even the 19 year old who had sex with his 16 year old girl friend… or even the nine year old who was found play doctor and labeled as a predator. In today’s age, I think any homosexual who even looks at a child wrong is asking to be put on someone’s list…. hmmm… according to Kane… that could include heterosexuals, as well. We gotta watch out for those who truely care for kids.. .they are probably grooming them. Well, I gotta admit… I ‘groomed’ all of my kids. Bought them presents, did nice things for them and with them, spent a lotta time with them. We talked about… ohmygosh… sex. We even slept together (will I go to jail with Micheal jackson) on occassion. Terrible person that I am, did much the same with my neices and nephews, too. Apply their ‘risk assessment’ to me and I’d fail for sure. I even swatted one young feller up aside the head… certainly a jailable offense these days. bobb – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->> bobb
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -bobb wrote: > <kane_poh…@yahoo.com> wrote in message > news:1113528727.328949.163590@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com… > > Greegor wrote: > >> Kane excused supervisory chain of command at CPS agencies > >> for not being aware of what takes place on their watch? > > No I didn’t. I pointed out the difficulties involved. Or are you > > suggesting it’s an easy job? And of course mistakes would not happen if > > you were doing it? > >> Any supervisor, and any level, bears a responsibility to > >> supervise the activities under their supervision. > > That’s right. They are not psychics, however. Or is it required that no > > unacceptable events may happen and any supervisor upon whose watch they > > do must be fired? > > I have a hunch we’d run out of supervisors. What do you think? > >> In law suits, the phrases are "knew or SHOULD HAVE KNOWN" > >> and "Failure to supervise". > > Ah, the "should have known." > > You do not understand the implications. > > That would suggest there are events judged by others, as NOT being > > KNOWN because there was no reason the supervisor "SHOULD HAVE KNOWN." > > In other words, it’s been decided that supervisors are not required to > > be psychics. If it was sent to a supervisor in a form that is > > recognized as being a "should have known" say an email, or memo, or in > > conference, then the super should have known. > > If it was being passed around the office as rumor, it may well be the > > supervisor had not way to know for sure. Of if an event was reported > > while the supervisor was away on say vacation, and during the time > > after returning they were going through their correspondance and had > > not come to the item that exploded into a major event, they would not > > be seen as having ‘SHOULD HAVE KNOWN," since it was physically > > impossible to do so. > > The trick you folks like to play doesn’t work if YOU are in the > > hotseat. > > You would scream foul. In fact, geegor, you scream fould even when you > > SHOULD HAVE KNOWN, that is you were told point blank, publically, but > > chose to ignore or go against what you were told. > >> Supervisors who don’t supervise because they think > >> their deliberate ignorance will shield them are getting > >> some REALLY BAD legal advice! > > Nope. It doesn’t work that way. If they were officially and or > > according to standards of practice not informed or couldn’t know, by > > virtue say of extenuating circumstances, like absense, making it > > physically impossible for them to know. Then they weren’t ignorant for > > deliberate intend to be, but because they could NOT know. > Since we all report to someone, I gotta tell ya there are three words > a manager does not want to hear.. "I don’t know".
Oh, even if it’s the truth? > Of course, the > manager must ask all the right questions, he need information to > set the course and to prepare for the unexpected… speaking of > good manager, of course.
And sometimes the worker simply does not know. > I suspect CPS neither asks the right > questions, don’t know the questions to ask, or just don’t care.
You "suspect" a lot of things, and not just about CPS, that are ridiculous speculative unethical assumptions based on lack of facts, and your enjoyment of remaining ignorant so you can spout such suspicions. When you are told the facts you run from them, as do your cronies. > Go one step futher.. if the caseworkers don’t do the job > properly… it is once again the manager’s problem in that proper > direction and/or direction was not afforded.
It can be. And it can not be. Depends if the worker followed the practices that are considered standard, and any directions of the supervisor. I take it perfection is the only acceptable performance standard. You, of course, always performed your work perfectly. 0;-> > Hmmm… you mentioned something caseworkers employing use > of a "Psychic hotline" which I would be rather caseworkers are rather > adept.
Actually when I mention that it’s an accusation that one of you twits have demanded workers know things they could not unless they had access to psychic abilities. My you are a dullard. > Let’s see, they accurately predict ‘risk’ of injury, neglect, and > abuse.
No, they do not. Nor do they claim to. > They forsee hazards before they occur and immediately remove > children from ‘harms’ way.
They utilize the same tools that actuaries do…charting of prior events with known outcomes. Would you suggest that actuaries are psychics? In the recent posting on the assessment tool for one state, a tool that was lauded as the best in the nation by the way, they in fact created it out of known factors in cases of abuse and neglect. It’s like reverse engineering. If you know the outcome, which of course you do by picking those cases that do have adverse outcomes, and those that don’t, and looking at the factors leading to both outcomes, it’s not magic or psychic abilities that make outcome predictable. We know for instance, in a city with outdoor private swiming pools that are unfenced, that a predicatable number of drownings of children will take place. It’s like clockwork. All you have to know is the number of such pools and the number of children in a particular age range in the town. The rest is simple math. > By the time caseworkers advance to manager I’d suggest they should > have these skills well practiced and should have no trouble recognizing > caseworkers who are not doing their jobs properly. I mean just > ask them… they are professionals, remember?
You’d be surprized to find out that that in fact is a fact. They do generally have the skills, and they do know when a worker isn’t doing their job properly. They apply various techniques, just as in any discipline, to both intervene proactively (training and low numbers of easier caseloads to start with), then provide not only their own supervision, but have experienced long time workers provide oversight and assistance on casework issues. Your determination to remain stupid and ignorant is becoming something of a minor miracle. It’s hard to believe someone can be so dedicated. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22training+the+new%22+%2BCPS+%2… http://tinyurl.com/9s98a > > If you think otherwise, pop up some proof other than innuendo. > > No one, least of all I, is defending a supervisor that KNOWS what is > > going on and yet does not act correctly on that information. You don’t > > read what I write, you just see what you want, instead of what, from my > > statements, you "SHOULD HAVE KNOWN." > They why did you throw in that little tidbit about needing ’ a psychic hot > line’?
Because your expectation if that they know what is impossible to know. > There is no defense for a manager that fails to keep informed. There is no > defense for a manager to keep an enept employee in his/her charge.
Of course their is. Not all employees start off perfect in their job performance. Are you this stupid? And managers (we are actually talking her about supervisors, the next layer down, dummy) cannot be completely informed at any given time. Information flow takes time. Even with E-mail. And supervisors have duties other than supervision. They do case review. They serve one in house as well as extra CPS committees and workgroups. There are layers of supervision that include "lead workers," officially designated job titles that include combinations of "trainer, mentor, assistant" to workers. Sometimes even experienced workers are snowed under by unforseen events and these staffers, usually folks close to retirement with a great deal of experience, can step in and help them. They LIVE with the work units and stay familiar with all the cases for just these purposes. > A manager cannot plead ignorance.
Of course they can. You are setting impossible standards that no other discipline demands. If a doctor, for instance, is given a lab report that is inaccurate, and proceeds with TX that injures or kills, who is responsible? The lab tech, of course, even though the boss is the doctor. Only a fool would claim the doctor had to be a psychic. If an event happens that is critical to a case, and the worker does not record it and inform their supervisor, is the supervisor at fault? Tell us you were a perfect worker, bobber. I need a laugh. You can’t even understand what is written here, and constantly bollocks up facts and simple events. > bobb > > Point out where I defend the supervisor that knew what was going on and > > failed to act properly.
You failed to respond. Just as you nearly always do when you screw up and I challenge you to provide support for your messy mind and stupid mistakes. > > 0:->
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Response:
<kane_poh…@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1113528727.328949.163590@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Greegor wrote: >> Kane excused supervisory chain of command at CPS agencies >> for not being aware of what takes place on their watch? > No I didn’t. I pointed out the difficulties involved. Or are you > suggesting it’s an easy job? And of course mistakes would not happen if > you were doing it? >> Any supervisor, and any level, bears a responsibility to >> supervise the activities under their supervision. > That’s right. They are not psychics, however. Or is it required that no > unacceptable events may happen and any supervisor upon whose watch they > do must be fired? > I have a hunch we’d run out of supervisors. What do you think? >> In law suits, the phrases are "knew or SHOULD HAVE KNOWN" >> and "Failure to supervise". > Ah, the "should have known." > You do not understand the implications. > That would suggest there are events judged by others, as NOT being > KNOWN because there was no reason the supervisor "SHOULD HAVE KNOWN." > In other words, it’s been decided that supervisors are not required to > be psychics. If it was sent to a supervisor in a form that is > recognized as being a "should have known" say an email, or memo, or in > conference, then the super should have known. > If it was being passed around the office as rumor, it may well be the > supervisor had not way to know for sure. Of if an event was reported > while the supervisor was away on say vacation, and during the time > after returning they were going through their correspondance and had > not come to the item that exploded into a major event, they would not > be seen as having ‘SHOULD HAVE KNOWN," since it was physically > impossible to do so. > The trick you folks like to play doesn’t work if YOU are in the > hotseat. > You would scream foul. In fact, geegor, you scream fould even when you > SHOULD HAVE KNOWN, that is you were told point blank, publically, but > chose to ignore or go against what you were told. >> Supervisors who don’t supervise because they think >> their deliberate ignorance will shield them are getting >> some REALLY BAD legal advice! > Nope. It doesn’t work that way. If they were officially and or > according to standards of practice not informed or couldn’t know, by > virtue say of extenuating circumstances, like absense, making it > physically impossible for them to know. Then they weren’t ignorant for > deliberate intend to be, but because they could NOT know.
Since we all report to someone, I gotta tell ya there are three words a manager does not want to hear.. "I don’t know". Of course, the manager must ask all the right questions, he need information to set the course and to prepare for the unexpected… speaking of good manager, of course. I suspect CPS neither asks the right questions, don’t know the questions to ask, or just don’t care. Go one step futher.. if the caseworkers don’t do the job properly… it is once again the manager’s problem in that proper direction and/or direction was not afforded. Hmmm… you mentioned something caseworkers employing use of a "Psychic hotline" which I would be rather caseworkers are rather adept. Let’s see, they accurately predict ‘risk’ of injury, neglect, and abuse. They forsee hazards before they occur and immediately remove children from ‘harms’ way. By the time caseworkers advance to manager I’d suggest they should have these skills well practiced and should have no trouble recognizing caseworkers who are not doing their jobs properly. I mean just ask them… they are professionals, remember? > If you think otherwise, pop up some proof other than innuendo. > No one, least of all I, is defending a supervisor that KNOWS what is > going on and yet does not act correctly on that information. You don’t > read what I write, you just see what you want, instead of what, from my > statements, you "SHOULD HAVE KNOWN."
They why did you throw in that little tidbit about needing ’ a psychic hot line’? There is no defense for a manager that fails to keep informed. There is no defense for a manager to keep an enept employee in his/her charge. A manager cannot plead ignorance. bobb – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Point out where I defend the supervisor that knew what was going on and > failed to act properly. > 0:->
Response:
"bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message
news:3uedncqKlq-SbcLfRVn-og@comcast.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Kane wrote… > Did you bother to read the letter from a Portland Oregon volunteer > organization that in fact does prepare children to leave the system as > adults? Same problem. Not enough money. They do good work though with > the volunteers who come forward. > There are many, many agencies, mostly, if not all, private organizations > who are attempting to pick up the pieces CPS left behind and dumped on the > streets. > Let’s not forget… many foster parents play a part dumping kids on the > streets as well. When the money stops coming in.. the kid goes out. > The typical fare is to find the child housing,… and a job… and > possibly school. Kids are taught to shop, budget their money.. and their > time. Most are two year programs. The agency begin by picking up 100 > percent of the costs and gradually reduce funding until the program is > completed. Ya really have to feel sorry for kids without education and > resources… and most, many, and even a lot, come from CPS.
Mmmhmmmm, and do you feel sorry for the kids who are left in abusive and neglectful homes who don’t make it quite so well either? Poor kids, unable to cope with adult life because they have grown up their whole lives in dysfunctional homes, never getting a reprieve or help like those CPS kids. And one more thing, ‘many’ foster parents DO dump their kids….but ‘many’ don’t, and continue to take care of the kids AFTER the money is gone. Many. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> bobb
Response:
"bobb" <bob@somewhere> wrote in message
news:erudnRSLCtZZnPzfRVn-sw@comcast.com… > What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon to > become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age? Seems to me most > families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year old > "adult" children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut off > his allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals.
‘Most’, is that like ‘many’? And you better bet your ass that ’some’ parents do! As a matter of fact, I was one of them. > The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal > responibilities should not end at an age they determine. If fact, it > used to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t even > finished high school at age 18… but.. so what. CPS rids itself of > another problem and seeks other little kids… some like a predator, > wouldn’t you say?
So what you are saying is that DFS seeks out kids to keep in foster care until they turn 18. then they dump their asses out on the street with no money, no feed and nowhere to go, and then look for more kids to keep for the funding until they turn 18, rolling over and over again? Absurd. > Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them with > ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an allowance, > clothes, and the promise of a better life without their interferring > parents. Sound familiar?
It does NOT sound familiar to me. My daughter was one of those beyond parental control kids. She made a file folder full of DFS complaints against me for almost five years. My goal in life for those five years was to get her in control. DFS never once told that child that she could have a better life without interfering parents etc etc. What they told her was that *I* was the mom, and *SHE* was the kid and she would do as I told her or suffer her consequences. She once had a friend make a report that I had hit her with a broom When the worker arrived to investigate she asked if I had hit her with the broom. I said that I had, that I was sweeping the floor, and that she had called me a ‘bitch’ and when she did I tapped he on the leg with the broom handle. The worker asked to see her leg, did not see a mark, because I had not hit her hard at all, just TAPPED her to get her attention. And then she proceeded to give my daughter an hour long speech about how fortunate she was to live in a nice home, to have food on the table, and parents who cared enough about her to go out hunting for her all night when she didn’t come home on time, etc. I don’t recall the worker mentioning a ‘better’ place to live. > It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place > them in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ being > sexually abused. Actually, the risk so often mentioned by CPS… rises > to the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent.
Ahhhh, yes, first teachers are fulfilling the fantasies of young boys by having sex with them and should be thanked, then sexual abuse is not sexual abuse nor is rape rape, and now homosexuals are potentially (more) a risk for abuse than anyone else. Please, do show me where DFS says that children of homosexual homes are at more risk of abuse. I have never seen such a thing. > If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child > endangerment, neglect, and abuse.
And here I can agree with you. At time the actions of DFS, and even doctors and hospitals and therapists (mandated reporters) mimics the same behaviors that would warrant investigation of a parent. Fired one thrapist for behaviors that would have gotten my ass nailed, and threatened the whole pediatric staff at a local hospital with lawsuit for behaviors that would have gotten me founded by DFS for abuse, or at the least, neglect. But exactly what does that have to do with it? Does DFS charge parents who put out the 18 year old kid and refuse to take care of them? I highly doubt it Bob…show me, I’m from Missouri. Unless that child is mentally or physically unable to care for themselves…then no, prove it. Does DFs file against a parent who allows a child, for whatever reason, to live with a homosexual aunt or uncle or cousin for ‘risk of harm’? Hell no, if they do you show me where it’s happened. I KNOW that’s a lie. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> bobb
Response:
Kane wrote…
Did you bother to read the letter from a Portland Oregon volunteer organization that in fact does prepare children to leave the system as adults? Same problem. Not enough money. They do good work though with the volunteers who come forward. There are many, many agencies, mostly, if not all, private organizations who are attempting to pick up the pieces CPS left behind and dumped on the streets. Let’s not forget… many foster parents play a part dumping kids on the streets as well. When the money stops coming in.. the kid goes out. The typical fare is to find the child housing,… and a job… and possibly school. Kids are taught to shop, budget their money.. and their time. Most are two year programs. The agency begin by picking up 100 percent of the costs and gradually reduce funding until the program is completed. Ya really have to feel sorry for kids without education and resources… and most, many, and even a lot, come from CPS. bobb
Response:
bobb wrote: > Kane wrote… > Did you bother to read the letter from a Portland Oregon volunteer > organization that in fact does prepare children to leave the system as > adults? Same problem. Not enough money. They do good work though with > the volunteers who come forward. > There are many, many agencies, mostly, if not all, private organizations who > are attempting to pick up the pieces CPS left behind and dumped on the > streets.
Since CPS is not mandated, nor funded, to deal with adults, how is it in fact dumping children on the street if those children are not longer children and what, bobber, do you think should be done about that? While you are cogitating please try to recall that things cost money. Even doing things costs money. And the biggest problem for kids that become adults, just like in my day, and in yours, is how to create a personal income. List your items you think CPS should have done to solve this problem: 1. 2. 3. (add more, at your pleasure) > Let’s not forget…
If we aren’t going to forget then be sure we have a real, not false, memory. > many foster parents play a part dumping kids on the > streets as well. When the money stops coming in.. the kid goes out.
And the alternative would be? > The typical fare is to find the child housing,… and a job… and possibly > school.
Yes, that would make a lot of sense. My take is that about three quarters of the children that are approaching their majority could give a shit. They will not listen to adults trying to prepare them. They will not attend classes. The only two ways they can learn, except from their peers…which of course, tends all to often to be telling them garbage. "Hey, buy my guitar off me and become a rock star, get laid a lot, and do dope, and make millions." > Kids are taught to shop, budget their money.. and their time. Most > are two year programs. The agency begin by picking up 100 percent of the > costs and gradually reduce funding until the program is completed. Ya > really have to feel sorry for kids without education and resources… and > most, many, and even a lot, come from CPS.
Oh, you mean this takes money then. And that money will come from where, bobber? Why are you ragging the ng about this instead of appealing to the public? CPS, last I heard, was not the treasury. And I believe I’ve been criticized for suggesting CPS is underfunded. What are YOU doing for those teens, bobber? > bobb
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Response:
When a member of a family takes such GLARING problems as the LIE about a sex abuse history used to make a case, to a CPS supervisor, that supervisor can not claim that they did not know. Their refusal to fix that sort of WRONG is culpable. The family should not have to seek out every single level of supervision over their case to seek correction of such glaring CORRUPTION in their agency!
Response:
Greegor wrote: > When a member of a family
You know of such an event? A real blood or by marriage related family member? That would be then, a giant tsk tsk. You go tell Iowa I said so. > takes such GLARING > problems as the LIE about a sex abuse history used > to make a case, to a CPS supervisor, that supervisor > can not claim that they did not know.
You can assure us that no other factors were used? Or would this be one of those "clutter" cases you charmers like to post here, where you focus on one small issue in an investigation and don’t bother to mention the real serious stuff that were the real cause? > Their refusal to fix that sort of WRONG is culpable.
What obligation do they have to fix it if, by chance, the "family memeber" is in fact not one, and in fact has other issues that are the reason the child was remove? > The family should not have to seek out every single > level of supervision over their case to seek correction > of such glaring CORRUPTION in their agency!
Since we doubt the ‘family member’ actually was one, and that there was ample OTHER issues that no doubt at all contributed to the case, we think you are blowing a long….let’s comin’ up on four years now….stream of smoke up people’s xxxxxx in this ng. Tell us your story, greegor. Such what did happen, in precise detail, recalling of course much of the story you shared already…so try to keep the details sorted out. Say, by the way. What do you think about parents using lethal force to try and take their children from state custody?
Response:
What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon to become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age? Seems to me most families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year old "adult" children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut off his allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals. The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal responibilities should not end at an age they determine. If fact, it used to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t even finished high school at age 18… but.. so what. CPS rids itself of another problem and seeks other little kids… some like a predator, wouldn’t you say? Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them with ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an allowance, clothes, and the promise of a better life without their interferring parents. Sound familiar? It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place them in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ being sexually abused. Actually, the risk so often mentioned by CPS… rises to the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent. If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child endangerment, neglect, and abuse. bobb
Response:
bobb wrote: > What about the mis-spent money leading up to the time the child, soon to > become an adult by some arbitray, pre-determined age?
"Mis-spent money?" (sic) You mean the money spent for other equally, if sometimes even more important mandated requirements of CPS, such as investigations or other duties? Just tell your legislator how YOU wish the money apportioned…money that is, according to media reports, being cut all over the country. > Seems to me most > families don’t dump their kids, oh, I forgot, their now 18 year old "adult" > children, on the street the day after his birthday. Or cut off his > allowance, or refuse to provide housing, or even meals.
CPS has no mandate to parent children, let alone when parent them when they are adults. One of the favorite mantras of the anti Government crowd is that the state does not make a good parent. They are correct, nor should it even try. While programs to help children exist, you seem to forget that programs for adult indigents exist too, bobber. Most of what happens to young people that is considered bad after leaving state custody has to do with the unwillingness of some youth to accept any services from the state. When you figure out how to deal with this issue, you’ll be a national hero. > The state, as suragate parents, need to recognize their parantal > responibilities should not end at an age they determine.
Your mistake is in assuming that the state is mandated to be a surrogate parent. It is not. It is, and the public demands, only a stop gap. The fantasy that children are, the day they become adults, thrown out on the street with NO OTHER RESOURCES AVAILABLE is a pile of crap and any person that has even rudimentary knowledge of government services and agencies, and for that matter charitable private sources knows you twits are lost in your anti Government hallucinations. http://www.co.arapahoe.co.us/Departments/HS/ChildProtectionServices/a… Here for instance, is the typical population of teens in state custody or or otherwise in need of state services. " The Adolescent Intake team supports teens with serious problems in school, lack of respect for authority, drug or alcohol involvement, severe legal involvement, conflicted family relationships, and runaways. Youth In Conflict services work to alleviate conflicts, protect youth and the community, re-establish family stability, or assist youth to emancipate successfully. Services are provided when the conflicts have the potential to affect the youth’s well-being, the normal functioning of the family, or the well-being of the community. " Do you think such "children" are going to lend themselves to state services on their birthday, if they are already in trouble with the state criminal system? All persuasion that existed at 17 years 364 days is gone on day 365. The "child" may walk, and does, most often. > If fact, it used > to be 21… but that was lowered to age 18. Most kids haven’t even finished > high school at age 18…
Oh? What backwater are you in? Many children graduate at 17. It’s these troubled and disadvantaged children that don’t graduate at all that you are concerned about. And CPS lacks a mandate to continue services, with rare exception, after they turn 18. Your problem, bobber is that you want to BLAME instead of seek answers. The state this and the state that…but bobber, YOU are the state, despite your denial of the fact. What are YOU doing to help this children you anquish over? but.. so what. CPS rids itself of another problem > and seeks other little kids… some like a predator, wouldn’t you
say? No, but you would, obviously. The CPS I know is filled with workers that volunteer their time to these children after their regular work hours in programs to help them learn to become responsible adults. They fail a lot. And they fail a lot not because of foster families, or CPS, but because the children came from horrendous birth families that have not prepared them to become adults. > Hmmm… yeah, they seek out little kids, groom them by treating them with > ‘care’ and ‘kindness’, offer them a ‘better’ place to live, an allowance, > clothes, and the promise of a better life without their interferring > parents. Sound familiar?
No, because that’s not what happens. What happens, and it was twice codified into law very clearly, nationally, is that extraordinary efforts are made to help the bio families they came from to get their acts together, and mostly they tend to "greegor" and "douggie" and "bobber" blaming the state for their troubles. They don’t think they have a problem. And they’ll go to great lengths to try and lie their way along. > It even sounds strangely suspicious that they would intentionally place them > in the care of homosexuals, and other places where they ‘risk’ being > sexually abused.
Where did you get the idea, other than from the media, and your sick friends, that homosexuals by their sexual orientation are more prone to sexually molest children? > Actually, the risk so often mentioned by CPS… rises to > the level of a certainty and with deliberate intent.
The mindless twittering is obviously on a feedback loop and burning out what little brain matter you have left. You are prepared to say that those children are placed with by CPS are certainly and with deliberate intent of the placement or CPS to be abused? Do I read you correctly? > If a parent where to act as does CPS.. they would be charging child > endangerment, neglect, and abuse.
No, on the contrary. If parents had to meet the criteria that a typical foster parent must meet, both in qualifications and treatment of the chidlren in their care, the number of children taken from bio families would very likely be up to or more than half the families in this country. Just the criminal background checks and refusal to certify as "parents" as applicants to be foster parents experience, would easily cover half the country. Parents may legally spank their children in every state in the union. Foster parents, even if not a mark is made on the child, even a faint temporary mark, may not spank or use any kind of corporal punishment. As I recall there is one state where it is allowed, in the south I believe, but that is extremely rare. > bobb
Tirelessly and tiresomely, bobber the swift spouts illogical emotion laden nonsense, ignorant of facts, laden with propaganda fed to him by Doug and the "anti" crowd. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=%22youth+services%22&btnG=Se… Results 1 – 10 of about 1,520,000 for "youth services" Many entries include "young adults" and in fact CPS programs for teens aging out of the system make it a point to hook up these youngsters prior to that leaving. Some connect, some refuse to. CPS cannot make them connect. There are also charitable, often funded with grants from business and trusts, as well as some small city, county, state, and occassionally federal government grants. http://myfriendsplace.org/info.htm http://www.youthservice.org/ http://www.doleta.gov/youth_services/ In fact there are literally hundreds of such programs across the country, bobber, none of which you seem aware of, and obviously none of which you are involved with. You simply kvetch, and fart, as far as I can see, orally. There are churches, civic service clubs, men’s organizations, community enrichment organizations, and the government sponsored organizations that are addressing the issues for YOUTH, bobber. The editorial you read in another thread is basically a load of crap attempting to attack already beleaguered state government that is experiencing the revenue losses from an economy that is staggering along. Grow up, you old fart, and do something rather than sit and complain, wrongly. Or accept that YOU are part of the problem.
Response:
For many foster children, hard life begins as adults National study finds the system can leave staggering problems By MELANIE MARKLEY Copyright 2005 Houston Chronicle RESOURCES FALLOUT FROM FOSTER CARE
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