Question:
Hi Annie! < I snipped some : I still haven’t really decided for sure what route to take long term for : my problems with panic. I think I’m going to mull this one over for a : bit, since I feel like I keep swinging to different conclusions about : it, I’ll make a decision when it is clear to me. I will definitely keep : this group posted, and hopefully whatever I do will be a success. It is : funny, I think I got myself so worked up about worrying about how to : treat my panic disorder, that I ended up panicking about it! Ug. One : thing that rang clear from all of your posts is that I have to be true : to myself, no matter what other people in AA might think. One thing : that bugs me about the program is how quick some people are to judge : somebody else, even when they do not live in their skin and have no idea : how they may feel. < I snipped some more I think you are doing very well in planning your own choices. Good for you! You are obviously doing a lot of growing. I also have from time to time been VERY bothered by people who obviously have enuf "junk" of their own to work on, but are so narrow minded that they "throw rocks" at other people such as you and me. Since some of these people have hurt me very deeply, it took me a LONG time to understand one important fact. That is that these people, in order to SAVE/RESCUE themselves, have to walk a very "tight" straight and narrow path. When you look at it from this point of view, you have to admire their commitment to leading a better life. I don’t want to mislead you on this. I have learned that fact, but I can still be VERY bothered by these people. They can hurt! — … Tasha … ~8)
Response:
<snipped to save space… My question is, is there anybody out there who is has had an alcohol problem, is sober, even familiar with AA and their beliefs, and is able to take these medications safely and without guilt and the problem of addiction?
In the course of my recovery from addiction (alcohol and drugs) and because of a serious illness it has been necessary for me to take medications that have addictive properties, including benzodiazepans and narcotics. I was told by my sponser that I needed to check out where I am spiritually and to ask myself if I was taking this medication for health reasons or to avoid something life threw my way. Because of a chronic depression and the physical problems I have I regularly take an antidepressant, and have periodically taken medication for anxiety like xanax and ativan. I am still sober and consider myself so (thought die-hard AA’ers may disagree). I believe it is possible to take these medications safely when needed for health sake. Anxiety is a real and definite health problem and can be devastating without medications for people. Just make sure your mind and spirit are in the right place when taking your dose! JMS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <… Annie Hi, Annie. You have very real concerns. Many people who have trouble with addictions should avoid taking benzodizepines, such as Ativan. However, it is difficult to know if you are one of these many without knowing a lot more about you than can be learned online. When I read what you wrote, I wondered if you drank to take the edge off of the anxiety. Many people with anxiety disorders self-medicate with alcohol. It, of course, isn’t a good choice, since alcohol tends to heighten anxiety on the day after. This can lead to a cycle of using alcohol to dull the anxiety that was caused by the alcohol. I believe that you have to check inside yourself to know if meds can create a problem for you. Working with a physician you trust will also help. IMO, knowing why you drank will give you much insight into your question on if you should use anxiolytics. You also wrote that you didn’t want to take antidepressants because depression wasn’t a problem. Unfortunately, certain classes of meds got pegged with the name "antidepressants" even though they are used for a variety of problems. Many people with anxiety disorders, particularly panic disorders (PD) do well when taking certain antidepressants. Paxil and Zoloft are most frequently prescribed for PD these days, but there are a variety of antidepressants that can be used. If you choose the med-free route, you aren’t alone. There are many behavioral therapies that have been shown to be effective for treating PD. Deep breathing and relaxation techniques, exposure therapies, cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT), and personally-tailored daily programs (IOW, things you discover help you personally) work for many people. There are books written on the techniques that can help you work on getting better. I hope you are able to work through your concerns to find something that works for you. I understand your concerns, and feel that if you feel meds are not okay for you, then you should avoid them. If you decide to avoid them, perhaps it would be helpful to scout around for a psychologist or counselor with experience in working with anxiety disorders. There are many treatment options available, and they may be able to help guide you in the right direction. Much luck to you, Anita
Response:
Hello there, I just wanted to thank everyone for all of your responses to my post. I really got some wise advice from people in this newsgroup, and has been a really good experience for me to hear from many people who have had similiar experiences, THANK YOU, I genuinely appreciate it. I still haven’t really decided for sure what route to take long term for my problems with panic. I think I’m going to mull this one over for a bit, since I feel like I keep swinging to different conclusions about it, I’ll make a decision when it is clear to me. I will definitely keep this group posted, and hopefully whatever I do will be a success. It is funny, I think I got myself so worked up about worrying about how to treat my panic disorder, that I ended up panicking about it! Ug. One thing that rang clear from all of your posts is that I have to be true to myself, no matter what other people in AA might think. One thing that bugs me about the program is how quick some people are to judge somebody else, even when they do not live in their skin and have no idea how they may feel. One thing I really feel good about was that I was totally honest with the doctor that I saw, and I told him all about my history with alcohol, which I often used to calm myself down, but in addition to that, there was a myriad of reasons why I drank, escape from panic being a big one of them. He was very familiar with the Big Book and AA, and reminded me that even the founders of AA recommended getting medical advice for problems other than alcohol, which I am very glad I did, at least I know that I have other options if the non-medication route doesn’t work for me, and that in itself is a relief. I am thinking of trying to do mediation every morning daily, and I’m going to do more exercise and continue therapy, and hopefully make my work more manageable. I am thinking that if making some changes like this in my life do not work for my panic problems, that I will probably take the medication. The one thing I feel very strongly about is that my motivations really are good, and that I have no intention of wanting to get high, thankfully those days are over for me! I just want to feel normal and be able to function well with my life and not feel that I am avoiding situations because of irrational fears and wanting to avoid panic. Well, thank you again for all of the advice, it was good to hear how some of you dealt with this, and I am taking it all under consideration, and will let you know how it is going! A less confused panicker, Annie
Response:
X-No-Archive – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello there, I am looking for some advice, and perhaps some people who are in this newsgroup will have had experienced a similiar problem. Where should I start. I’ve been having panic attacks since my teens, (I’m 26 now) and I’ve become all too familiar with the symptoms, racing heart, sweaty palms, losing my sense of reality and equilibrium, and then exhaustion afterwards. They usually tend to occur when I am in a public situation, beginning a new class, having to make a presentation. They can also occur in social situations where I am trying to "impress," job interviews, dinners, parties, etc. I think the thing that I dread the most is the anticipitory anxiety, laying awake worrying that I will panic the next day, etc. I have been seeing a good therapist (psychologist) for about 4 months now, after a significant relationship brutally ended which left me not only extremely panicky and fearful, but terribly depressed. I am also a sober alcoholic who has been in AA for 2 years now, but I felt that I needed some extra help. After quite a few sessions she decided that I needed some more relief, and sent me to a psychiatrist. I told him about my drinking history (I never used other drugs besides alcohol), and that I was sober and how important my sobriety is to me. This did not deter him from writing 2 perscriptions, one for Elavil (an antidepressant), and the other for a low dosage of Ativan (Lorezapam). Well, here is my problem. I hate the anxiety and panic, yet I want to remain "sober," hence my dilemma about taking medications. I know that AA is not an anti-medical group, but many believe that taking anxiety medication is as bad as drinking. I have decided that I do not feel that I need to take anti-depressants since I do not consider myself clinically depressed, I can still function, I often just sad and down since my relationship ended which I am sure is normal since I have had to go through a natural grieving process. But, the anxiety isn’t normal, and frankly, it never has been. Am I sober if I take these drugs as perscribed? Well, I filled the perscription for Ativan and took one tonight as I was in my apartment severely stressing about beginning school tomorrow, and I already feel so guilty since sobriety is so very important to me. I don’t want to feel guilty, but I do. When I look at my motivations however, I realize that I do not want to feel "high," I REALLY don’t. I just want to feel normal and like I can function my life, and I don’t want to feel guilty about that! I also do not want to share these things with my AA contacts and friends, since I am afraid of rejection and them telling me that I relapsed or that I have done something wrong. They may not react this way, but I am fearful of it, since there are often strong opinions in AA. I am worried also about possible addiction to these medications, since I am naturally addicted to alcohol (but I have been completely sober for 2 years, and have no intention of drinking again.) I do not want to take them daily, only when I am under an unnatural degree of anxiety, which occurs in the situations I already described, and when I am anticipating an anxiety provoking situation. Plus, my being totally honest with the doctor and telling him my history did not deter him from perscribing them either, he seemed to think they were safe. My question is, is there anybody out there who is has had an alcohol problem, is sober, even familiar with AA and their beliefs, and is able to take these medications safely and without guilt and the problem of addiction? Also, anybody who has any insights about what I could possibly do about this and/or opinions, please let me know. A very confused panicker, Annie
Hi Annie, Fellow AA’er here, (and also out of 3yr relationship with a woman with chronic panic attacks, but thats another story). (I read this newsgroup from time to time, to try to gain a better understanding of panic disorder). I just recently had 9 yrs. of sobriety, in my mid 30’s, college grad. Back in Spring of ‘96 I had a sleeping disorder, my doctor thought it was anxiety (might’ve been , dunno for sure).I do believe that I empathized to such an extent with my former girlfriend, that I actually ended up with anxiety myself. (please dont bash me too hard for saying that, its difficult enough to try and understand). Anyway he knows my history well, and prescribed Buspar. Buspar was a waste of time for me, it virtually did nothing. He then cautiously suggested Ativan. He gave me a low dose, to take 3 times a day, for several weeks. (I believe 1mg x 3 times a day) I wasn’t crazy about the idea, but needed to destress, and get sleep. (after 11 nights of <2 hrs. sleep) I dealt with the initial hurdle of taking any addictive medication, when I took a Codiene medication for a week, following dental surgery, and I took the prescription as indicated. Sure, it was a little scarey, but ultimately its ME who decides if I will take more than whats indicated, NOT the drugs presence. Basically, TO THINE OWN SELF BE TRUE. (not shouting here just emphasis) 
I did not get hooked to the Codiene, nor did I want to. Anyway, I ended up taking the Ativan 2 times a day, rather than 3. (It made me sleepy in the afternoon, when I didn’t want to be, plus I was concerned about the addictiveness of Benzo’s. I took Ativan for 3 months, then abruptly stopped. (stupid). Even on the low dosage I had been taking, at levels LESS than what was indicated, I still had 2 days of withdrawal, with mild tremors, and sleeplessness. I WAS ANGRY! ANGRY at my disease (addiction) , and angry that I STILL had withdrawal symptoms, taking LESS than what was prescribed. The only caveat here is that I should have cut down to 1 a day, then 1/2 a day, then finally none. But, I didn’t, I just wanted to feel like my old self again. (the sleeping problem , and anxiety had abated).Stopping abruptly wasnt a good idea. I decided at that point, no more taking chances like that again. Since then, Melotonin, and some natural herbs can help me relax enough to sleep, etc. I dont have panic disorder, so I dont know what other things are out there. My former girfriend took Xanax, but thats much more addictive than Ativan. (its half-life is longer). So thats my story. Not to get into any philosophical tugs-of-war with the other respondents, but an ADDICTION IS AN ADDICTION IS AN ADDICTION, whether its airplane glue, alcohol, or prescription drugs. In most of the meetings I go to (East Coast), there are probably fewer than 5% of people, that are strictly alcoholics. Most are cross-addicted. There are a number of people who fool themselves into thinking they can abuse prescription drugs, but not drink, and are therefore still sober. I DONT THINK SO. Usually its not too long thereafter that you dont see them in the rooms anymore. One guy had 17 years, then decided to he needed Percodan for some back injury he got from weightlifting. The difference of course is that he abused it, got more ’scrips from different doctors, and went on a 2 year binge. Its scarey stuff, especially for we "blessed" with disease of addiction. So whatever you decide to do, be careful,stay sober and to thine own self be true. _ATTillaH.
Response:
I am so glad to hear you are feeling more positive about all of this. Getting rid of the self-doubt is half the battle, in my mind. Good luck to you, whatever you decide! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello there, I just wanted to thank everyone for all of your responses to my post. I really got some wise advice from people in this newsgroup, and has been a really good experience for me to hear from many people who have had similiar experiences, THANK YOU, I genuinely appreciate it. I still haven’t really decided for sure what route to take long term for my problems with panic. I think I’m going to mull this one over for a bit, since I feel like I keep swinging to different conclusions about it, I’ll make a decision when it is clear to me. I will definitely keep this group posted, and hopefully whatever I do will be a success. It is funny, I think I got myself so worked up about worrying about how to treat my panic disorder, that I ended up panicking about it! Ug. One thing that rang clear from all of your posts is that I have to be true to myself, no matter what other people in AA might think. One thing that bugs me about the program is how quick some people are to judge somebody else, even when they do not live in their skin and have no idea how they may feel. One thing I really feel good about was that I was totally honest with the doctor that I saw, and I told him all about my history with alcohol, which I often used to calm myself down, but in addition to that, there was a myriad of reasons why I drank, escape from panic being a big one of them. He was very familiar with the Big Book and AA, and reminded me that even the founders of AA recommended getting medical advice for problems other than alcohol, which I am very glad I did, at least I know that I have other options if the non-medication route doesn’t work for me, and that in itself is a relief. I am thinking of trying to do mediation every morning daily, and I’m going to do more exercise and continue therapy, and hopefully make my work more manageable. I am thinking that if making some changes like this in my life do not work for my panic problems, that I will probably take the medication. The one thing I feel very strongly about is that my motivations really are good, and that I have no intention of wanting to get high, thankfully those days are over for me! I just want to feel normal and be able to function well with my life and not feel that I am avoiding situations because of irrational fears and wanting to avoid panic. Well, thank you again for all of the advice, it was good to hear how some of you dealt with this, and I am taking it all under consideration, and will let you know how it is going! A less confused panicker, Annie
Leslie The opinions expressed are those of the author and *not* those of Harvard University. ***Note: Remove the "xx." before usa1.com in address before e-mailing. Just trying to foil the spammers…
Response:
Hello there, I am looking for some advice, and perhaps some people who are in this newsgroup will have had experienced a similiar problem. Where should I start. I’ve been having panic attacks since my teens, (I’m 26 now) and I’ve become all too familiar with the symptoms, racing heart, sweaty palms, losing my sense of reality and equilibrium, and then exhaustion afterwards. They usually tend to occur when I am in a public situation, beginning a new class, having to make a presentation. They can also occur in social situations where I am trying to "impress," job interviews, dinners, parties, etc. I think the thing that I dread the most is the anticipitory anxiety, laying awake worrying that I will panic the next day, etc. I have been seeing a good therapist (psychologist) for about 4 months now, after a significant relationship brutally ended which left me not only extremely panicky and fearful, but terribly depressed. I am also a sober alcoholic who has been in AA for 2 years now, but I felt that I needed some extra help. After quite a few sessions she decided that I needed some more relief, and sent me to a psychiatrist. I told him about my drinking history (I never used other drugs besides alcohol), and that I was sober and how important my sobriety is to me. This did not deter him from writing 2 perscriptions, one for Elavil (an antidepressant), and the other for a low dosage of Ativan (Lorezapam). Well, here is my problem. I hate the anxiety and panic, yet I want to remain "sober," hence my dilemma about taking medications. I know that AA is not an anti-medical group, but many believe that taking anxiety medication is as bad as drinking. I have decided that I do not feel that I need to take anti-depressants since I do not consider myself clinically depressed, I can still function, I often just sad and down since my relationship ended which I am sure is normal since I have had to go through a natural grieving process. But, the anxiety isn’t normal, and frankly, it never has been. Am I sober if I take these drugs as perscribed? Well, I filled the perscription for Ativan and took one tonight as I was in my apartment severely stressing about beginning school tomorrow, and I already feel so guilty since sobriety is so very important to me. I don’t want to feel guilty, but I do. When I look at my motivations however, I realize that I do not want to feel "high," I REALLY don’t. I just want to feel normal and like I can function my life, and I don’t want to feel guilty about that! I also do not want to share these things with my AA contacts and friends, since I am afraid of rejection and them telling me that I relapsed or that I have done something wrong. They may not react this way, but I am fearful of it, since there are often strong opinions in AA. I am worried also about possible addiction to these medications, since I am naturally addicted to alcohol (but I have been completely sober for 2 years, and have no intention of drinking again.) I do not want to take them daily, only when I am under an unnatural degree of anxiety, which occurs in the situations I already described, and when I am anticipating an anxiety provoking situation. Plus, my being totally honest with the doctor and telling him my history did not deter him from perscribing them either, he seemed to think they were safe. My question is, is there anybody out there who is has had an alcohol problem, is sober, even familiar with AA and their beliefs, and is able to take these medications safely and without guilt and the problem of addiction? Also, anybody who has any insights about what I could possibly do about this and/or opinions, please let me know. A very confused panicker, Annie
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